Panorama - so far in...

Re: Panorama - so far in...

BengalcatRVN — Sat, 24 Jul 2010 22:54:15 GMT

I agree with you.

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Tracy Windler RVN — Sat, 24 Jul 2010 22:47:10 GMT

I am not going to re-iterate what others have already, very eloquently put. We all know there were things happening in that footage that should not have happened, but I wish to raise a few points about the inaccuracies I found in the programme, which, I feel, deceived the public and have led to this viscious attitude which some of out fellow nurses are now suffering from.

1. Jeremy Vine states that "Veterinary bills have TREBLED in the last 10 years" but fails to explain the reason for this is not profiteering, or inflated Vet's salaries, but the fact that so many practices now require expensive equipment, often have to employ night staff, have a huge wasted drugs bill every month from tightened VMD regulations etc, and lastly, many choose to employ qualified and / or experienced staff who they have to pay more.

2. Another JV statement, which I can't believe no-one else has mentioned, when referring to the UK as a nation of animal lovers "We'll pay just about anything to see they're alright". Absolute JOKE!!! That does not describe about 70% of our clients, and we have mainly lovely, affluent clients! Why not make that " We'll pay as much as we feel it is worth" which usually has no resemblance with the actual cost.

3. Ok, the Yogi situation was distressing, and there were so many ways they could have avoided as much stress as the animal had, but it was a bad situation to begin with, so to say " he's aleady stressed:-he's being held by a trainee" was strongly suggesting she had made him that way, when there were so many other contributing factors.

4. "Over and over again she (Alex Lee) saw Medivet trainees carrying out procedures they shouldn't be" How is this informative?! How many incidences, once a month, once a day, once a week, or just the incidences we saw? How can a reputable journalist make claims like that to the nation without showing us proof?

5. I agree with previous comments about the "New graduate" who was having trouble intubating a cat following the gap between premed and G.A. For one, if she has worked at a busy practice for a year, she will have done at least one a day, which makes her perfectly experienced and we've all come across the occasional cat who we struggle to intubate. I was quite upset with the scathing comments from Mike Jessop about that case.

6. With regard to the happy Medivet client, who they interview, JV says "luckily, she has pet insurance" Luck?! Did she win the insurance in a raffle? No, she's responsible, NOT lucky!!

7. The donated blood. That was a tenuous issue. They never even used it, but surely the much-valued blood would be better used in an emergency, or for a stray dog who had no funding. They were suggesting to the public that this was intended as a money-making scam, but we have no proof of that.

I am as disgusted by some of the behaviour as everyone else on here, but this was still a hugely biased programme. However, I am hoping that it does raise awaremess of the need for QVN's, who then have the support of experienced ANA's and receptionists.

I was almost in tears thinking of all those hard-working, dedicated staff mentioned above, who have been abused because of this programme and the few idiotic, immature staff who featured in it. We're all behind you and hope you stick with it xx

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Katie Murphy RVN — Sat, 24 Jul 2010 18:12:10 GMT

A lot of points have already been raised here so I won't waffle on too much :)

I was saddened but not surprised by the undercover footage. When I trained I was always supervised and helped by the qualified nurses and vets and it was always checked whether I was comfortable with the task. Yet I have witnessed in my career unqualified staff and students doing tasks like placing catheters (some of you may remember a little while ago my post about how I was accused of picking on people because I asked them not to do such procedures).

Unfortunately the view of some employers is that trainee nurses are cheap labour. The actual words of my now ex-boss is that "he prefers to have non-qualified nurses working on the OOH rota because they are paid less". That says to me that he has no idea of what nurses actually do - if people think that a trainee with 3 weeks worth of experience can do as much as a qualified nurse then they obviously don't think that qualified nurses are that skilled! So apart from demeaning our qualification and our hard work - it's also potentially giving animals substandard care whilst they are ill.

There needs to be a greater recognition of the profession not only in the eyes of the public but in the vets too.

Its a shame the program didn't work towards a positive end in educating clients about the role of registered nurses in practice and what they are trained to do.

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Heather Barlow — Sat, 24 Jul 2010 18:09:05 GMT

Not sure that I can really comment on the finance side of things, working for a charity. However I was very disappointed that the young trainees seemed to have little or no supervision from any qualified staff. However I was very much more worried by thier overall attitude, both to procedures they are not qualified to perform and thier blatent lack of empathy towards the animals in thier care. If they were unable to see that they are dealing with sentient beings, who are away from thier loved one and the security this provides, coupled with the fact they are at very least feeling uncomfortable and fearful, then they should just not be doing the job that they are! It does not take anything other than common sense to see when an animal is distressed and in pain, this does not really need time to learn, it should just be obvious. Indeed they were unable to respect the animals are someones very much cherished and loved friend. And yet one of the silly young girls managed to conclude she would be rather upset if one of her animals was treated the way she so easily treated someone else's. If the Veterinary Nursing profession wants to be treated with respect, we need to weed out such immature, unthinking and unfeeling silly young people, who are better suited to work in a grocery shop where the only thing they can abuse is the odd carrot, or tomato. Having worked as a Veterinary Nurse for the last 30 years I can say I was very ashamed that others might think we are all like that. Thank goodness I work for a Veterinary Charity who would not sanction such behaviour in thier staff. These youngsters did not even have the intelligence to see they should be more caring.

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Stella Skelton RVN — Sat, 24 Jul 2010 17:29:32 GMT

Our company has issued info. regarding standard responses to questions raised by the public and we're offering tours of the practice.

Our poor placement SVN was shouted at by a member of the public OUT of work yesterday as she was on her way home in the student greens. This is the kind of thing that shouldn't happen and as as a result of Panorama I'm sure a few of us will have to deal with it.This may be something to complain about??

Lastly, the program has affected our practice as there's only 1 QVN and me (SVN) as employees and our bosses are trying to get us to work every other weekend now instead of our 2 staff that will hopefully be students come September...we're saying no to this as it's too much (we work full weekends). We've been extremely flexible so far by covering staff that have left and I'm sure they don't realise just how much we do work for them. Staff meeting is on Monday and i think everything will kick off. It sucks. We told them they needed to hire another QVN when our previous QVN left but they ignored us and now they're in a pickle. I hope they learn from this. They'll have to get a locum or something.

There needs to definitely be more QVN's and the vets need to be less concerned about money and more concerned about doing the job they trained for so long to do.

(Let me point out that the other 2 members of staff wouldn't be performing schedule 3 duties on a weekend and the vet is always present.)

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Stella Skelton RVN — Sat, 24 Jul 2010 17:04:57 GMT

[quote user="icklesal"]

The way that nurse played with the semi ga'd cat was awful! Some good points highlighted and some moo points too! Wasnt as bad as i thought tho, i didnt shout half as much as i expected!

[/quote]

Ditto!!

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Nichola231 — Sat, 24 Jul 2010 16:59:18 GMT

Wow this got big very quickly!

The bit that really annoyed me was that guy "man handling" a dog a few hours after surgery! If the dog wasn't going to be receiving IV treatment than why wasn't the catheter taken out while it was recovering or still under? Or just left in for a few days? (well maintained of course) Better to have one ready than rush to find a vein if the dog needs emergency treatment or something.

Also, why didn't the Irish Setter have a harness on and it's collar taken off if it was dyspneic? And holding it by it's neck?! AND a trainee placing a catheter?! OMG!

Rant over!

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Dreamcatcher — Sat, 24 Jul 2010 13:24:08 GMT

Hello everyone,

I work for a Medivet practice (I won't say which one, but it wasn't one that was shown and I never met the undercover reporter). I just wanted to say I'm equally appalled by the footage from Thursday (I refuse to defend any of it, it's indefensible)... and to be honest have dreaded coming on here to read people's comments. Thank you to those of you who have offered kind words to the vast majority of us who are simply trying to do our jobs. I would really like to stress that, although there have been times over the past two years I have worked for Medivet when certain things have certainly been questionable (such as unqualifieds carrying out tasks they shouldn't - many are indeed unaware of what they can and can't do-- and even many of the vets seem to be, particularly new grads) the very vast majority of vets, nurses, students, ANA's and receptionists are in the job for their love of animals and put 100% into caring for them. I can honestly say that I have NEVER witnessed anyone strike an animal in any of the Medivet practices I've worked at. I too would have something to say if I saw someone mucking around with a half-anaesthetised cat (as would all of my colleagues.)

I just really want everyone to know that the footage shown does in no way reflect how the rest of us behave. I took my job there as, like most of you, I had been searching for a trainee positiion for years, and they gave me this opportunity - without them I may still be looking. This programme has broken my heart - to see my innocent colleagues threatened because of the actions of a few has been very difficult. We have been advised to take basic security precautions- ie not wearing our uniform in public, and our names have been removed from Medivet's website.

Yesterday was very difficult, I didn't sleep very well on Thursday night and was dreading going in. Our practice has a good reputation locally and so thankfully got through the day without anything too horrendous happening to us. My heart sank everytime the phone rang- we had a lot of clients who were understandably worried, although so far only two cancellations and one history requested from another practice (I'm sure there will be more.) Nevertheless, it was a hard, tearful day for all of us. To have long standing clients who we have gotten to know over the months/years and are on first name terms with - to have them suddenly question what goes on and lose that little bit of trust for you is particularly hurtful.

I would like to say that although I think the show was irresponsible in someways (in view of the recent death threats to innocent people) it's not really Panorama that I feel angry towards. (Although I do think they could have shown more of some of the good things we do!) I do feel very angry and disappointed with the employees shown (many of them had left long before the show was aired. Those that haven't have been suspended ) who have tarred us all with the same brush and potentially put us in danger because of their stupid actions.

Anyway... there's not much more the rest of us can do other than to continue to work hard, do our best by our patients and just hope we regain the trust of our clients..

xxx

PS: Please spare a thought for the receptionist at the Medivet Head Office, the person who I feel most sorry for at the moment... I know her job was incredibly difficult yesterday.

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Nicola Smith — Sat, 24 Jul 2010 12:28:11 GMT

I think a lot of what happened is as a result of not enough qualified nurses , or people with mature attitudes. Too many young people behaving immaturely!! Not sure why they have so few qualifieds - maybe they wont pay or maybe they cant get them? I have witnessed groups of young trainees acting stupidly in the past and this has only been nipped in the bud by the other more mature members of staff, maybe not as bad as in the prgramme but taunting aggressive animals in cages to make them react which was then laughed at etc etc. As reagrds the pacing of catheters etc I would bet that 99% of those trainees didnt even know they were doing anything wrong, and thought they were allowed. Until veterinary nursing is more recognised and the need for qualified nurses is recognised these problems wil continue. The general public have no idea - I am most often thought of as a girl you watches the vet and has no formal training etc despite vn week displays and a very supportive boss!

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Sandra Taylor RVN, MBVNA — Sat, 24 Jul 2010 01:04:14 GMT

[quote user="FINNIGAN"]

felt uncomfortable watching this but thought they deserved what they got if thats how they behave, the way the nurse spoke to that poor cat whilst trying to get blood infuriated me, we nurse because we care about and are compassionate towards animals, i didnt feel this in her what so ever, what is she doing being a nurse!!!

i must admit i was a little nervous wearing my stripes in today and was on reception duty, waited for the backlash, only had 2 clients mention it but just coments that werent derogatory to us, in fact 3 people came in with thanku cards saying they thought we were a great team of people and were wonderfull towards thier animals, this was lovely and a fab gesture, obviously they had watched the programme and thought wed like a bit of moral support, we were all so touched, our boss also told us we wre great too, turned out to be a lovely day and i ended it feeling proud to be a stripey!!!

there are always one bad apple in the bag, and we know we do a good job and for the right reasons,

(im babbling now sorry)

[/quote]

Re: Panorama - so far in...

FINNIGAN — Sat, 24 Jul 2010 00:25:22 GMT

there are always one bad apple in the bag, and we know we do a good job and for the right reasons,

(im babbling now sorry)

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Mark Walsh — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 23:47:22 GMT

I have been to Medivet out of hours as a member of the public, before I started training as a nurse, it was to have my old cat put to sleep who had heart failure. I remember them being very caring, compassionate and sympathetic, this may have been about 9 years ago but I'm sure that on the whole they are still very good and agree that 99% of the staff who work for the chain are very good.

Maybe they should review their procedures for interviewing new staff, particularly new trainees, they should really let prospective employees know exactly what they are getting into, the long hours, the physical and emotional demands of the job and also that you need to be good with people as well as animals. Maybe it is too easy to get a trainee job at Medivet, the BBC lady did not have any background in animal care at all but still got employed. In the interview did they say to her that she would just be cleaning, stocking up syringes etc at the start? Did they say that she'll be expected to give injections, montior GAs etc without supervision of a vet or RVN?

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Polly P — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 23:09:02 GMT

There really are some amazing vets and nurses in Medivet, who are just as upset and horrified by the show as everyone else.

The nurse who did my initial training and all of the vets and nurses at that practice, and pretty much all of the other vets and nurses I worked with in the company were really fantastic, dedicated people trying their best and caring for the animals both practically and empathically to the highest standard.

I really feel for them in the coming weeks, with the way they will be scrutinised by the public and have been tarred with the same brush as those minor few in the show.

Don't forget MediVet has 75 or so practices, and 99.999% of the people working in them are the very best people you could ever hope to meet in the veterinary profession.

As an ex employee, I would still be happy to take my animals to MediVet to the branches I worked in, and having worked behind the scenes in them, in fact would feel much safer and more confident than I would going to any unknown branch, knowing the people who would care for them and having seen them in action.

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Michelle Lawrence — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 22:40:52 GMT

We had a few mentions of the programme today and one of our nurses recieved an ear bashing from a mop whilst on her lunch. Thanks for thinking of that panorama. The programme showed up some appaling actions but failed to show that it is the minority. We have worked hard to get our qualifications, we do it for the love of the job, its not a glamourous job or even a fantasically well paid job its just the job we love. Sending support our to all nurses especially those who have had to deal with the crap today and those nurses working in medivet who are just like ourselves and in it for the love of the job. Vet nursing is a passion, not just a job.

Re: Panorama - so far in...

jodieandrews — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 22:02:44 GMT

[quote user="*Steph *"]

We didn't have anyone mention it today - not a single word, all clients were smiling and are happy with what we offer them!

I'm not going to stress about this paranoidrama sh*t.. whats important to me is that I do a good job and that our clients are happy

[/quote] Thats a good way to think about it and I'm gonna follow suit. I know I do my job well and will continue to do so!

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Steph Phillips — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 21:45:27 GMT

We didn't have anyone mention it today - not a single word, all clients were smiling and are happy with what we offer them!

I'm not going to stress about this paranoidrama sh*t.. whats important to me is that I do a good job and that our clients are happy

Re: Panorama - so far in...

jodieandrews — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 21:38:46 GMT

I'm a first year SVN and quailified as an ANA last year. I went onto work this morning dreading the reaction the clients might have after the programme last night. I hoped they wouldn't notice my stripey uniform and brand me as one of 'those'. I waited along time to get my training postition and I love being a nurse. I found that I have been doubting my competance all day-can I do this, should I be doing this, do people trust me? We didn't get many questions from clients today-maybe they were too scared to ask? I swear I saw fear in the eyes of the owner who left his dog for an op today-or am I just being over sensitive? I have great pride and faith in this profession, in nursing and in my practice. It upset me to watch that programme last night but I know it doesn't show the full picture. I would like the BBC to do a programme about small practices struggling to survive, with so many clients coming in with animals that desperately need treatment but 'have no money' and then get angry with us when we are limited in the care we can provide. How it breaks our hearts. How we wish they could understand. Sorry for the ramble-lets think of something cheerful to talk about?!?

Re: Panorama - so far in...

lorraine wiggins — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 20:57:16 GMT

i do feel for medivet as not all staff were being nasty and terible workers. and the threats that i have heard them have is just not fair!! but u can not deny that their behaviour is not what clients want to see. ive worked in three different vets and ive never seen animals treated like that, and yeh i no that animals can get nasty and need restraining but there are the right ways and wrong ways of doing it. im glad our clients know what we are like as a practice and new last nights program was not a insite to every vets and hopefuly a one off.

what i dont think is right is that nurse that hit that shar pei should have been given a head nurse job as he obviously didnt have a clue how to restrain a aggressive dog.

let hope we have all learnt from this program one u never no who is watching u! lol and that we all love animals and would never do this and if we ever think these thoughts we would leave our job and find another one.

i no someone who worked for medivet and she said that never went on while she was there, it was just silly girls who dont understand what being or gettin to become a QVN is to some ppl.

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Anonymous — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 20:18:11 GMT

I have read every post on this discussion and some very valid points have been raised. I think it's really important to not just focus on Medi Vet - as with any profession there are good and bad establishments and employees up and down the country.

The RCVS seem to have red tape for so many things but is there anything in place to monitor behaviours such as those seen in last nights programme? I have never worked at a Medi Vet practice but have seen things in those practices I have worked at that if a camera had been on the wall a similiar outcry would have been had should it have become public knowledge.

I wonder if those members of staff that initally witnessed such going ons approached senior members of medivet before going to the BBC????

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Teh Fluffeh — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 19:37:38 GMT

For what it's worth, I highly doubt that anyone is reading all this rubbing their hands with glee that Medivet have taken a bashing, aside from any Panorama employees. If anything, it'll hopefully get them to fully open their eyes to what has been going on in certain practices that needs to be addressed and will help turn things around to make better conditions for staff, animals and clients.

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Busy bee — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 19:34:48 GMT

I spoke to a locum working in the Midlands and the delivery driver told him all the clients from the Medivet branch down the road had cancelled their appts - the car park was empty!

I feel sorry for any Medivet staff that may find themselves out of a job when they have done nothing wrong if it all goes t**s up

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Busy bee — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 19:31:04 GMT

[quote user="icklesal"]

[quote user="JaneRVN"]You can't run a good vets without QVNs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!![/quote]

Ahem and ANA's and Receptionists

[/quote]

of course!

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Claire Digby Maloney — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 19:23:36 GMT

I too was truely outraged by what was shown on last nights Panorama, but appreciate that this not reflective of all of the Medivet employees.

I have been a Qualified Veterinary Nurse for many years, hold a Cert SAN and opted to join the register as I believe we should be proud of the qualification that we hold. It takes alot of work, effort, determination and commitment to obtain this.

I have trained and still currently train SVN's and thoroughly enjoy this. I would never tolerate this behaviour - ever. It's unacceptable-end of story. I have, in the past, had to have discussions regarding behaviour/attitude that is not acceptable for the profession we are in, which is animal care, not just with nurses but with vets too.

Animal restraint is necessary, but this has to be done in a controlled and responsible manner.

In regards to the threats of violence, I hope Medivet are taking appropiate steps to ensure their staff are protected.

I hope the BVNA and RCVS will now promote the invaluble contribution that RVN's and VN's, SVN's and ANA's, who will hopefully go on to study and train to become a VN. I already discuss with my clients how to become a VN and they are surprised at the amount of work and dedication it takes. I also make them aware of the fact we have to have CPD to maintain our status as RVN. They appreciate this and are very confident in leaving their pets with us, knowing the standard of care their pets will be recieving from us.

May we all soon have the recognition we deserve.

A further point. I have been on the Medivet website (I believe it was not obtainable for part of today), they have posted a lengthy response to the footage shown last night and have stated they have taken action against some of the staff members. I hope that the VN's shown within the footage can now ensure that standards are set throughout all the practices. I wish them luck as this will be a difficult time for them.

Re: Panorama - so far in...

Teh Fluffeh — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 19:20:13 GMT

Medivet have put this up on their site now

http://www.medivet.co.uk/news_view.asp?id=115

Re: Panorama - so far in...

hobbits — Fri, 23 Jul 2010 17:05:45 GMT

Apparently the night staff at Medivet were receiving threats of violence and had someone say they were going to shoot the boss in the head

whatever issues were raised that need addressing - and there are a few, and these are by no means exclusive to Medivet - there is no call for that. Good on the dedicated, professional staff who work for medivet who I am sure are in the majority for being brave enough to go into work today and for the next few days. And good luck in ensuring your standards are spread through all branches which is Im sure what will happen now.

I hope it is a catalyst for change for the whole profession as far as recognising the difference between qualified, unqualified and training nursing staff goes but sadly I am a bit cynical about that....