Killer whale kills trainer!

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

loopylou711 — Thu, 04 Mar 2010 21:02:25 GMT

jst for anyone whos interested, the reply i got was this, my question was:

How many of your marine animals - whales and dolphins are rescued in comparision to ones captured or bred in captivity?

The answer:

We apologize for any inconvenience but the Ask Shamu service just provides general animal information as well as information about our parks, how we train the animals and careers working with animals. Our team does not track individual information about any of the animals at our parks due to the time constraints this project would produce. We can tell you that the vast majority of our whales and dolphins were born at our parks. We’ve had more than twenty killer whale births and more than 100 dolphin births over the years and each species is represented by multiple generations.

To find out about our Animal Rescue and Rehabilitation programs we recommend this section of our website: http://www.seaworld.org/animal-info/info-books/rescue-&-rehab/index.htm. We also have information about some of our most recent rescues on our seaworldparksblog.com website. We have been very busy this winter rescuing and rehabilitating cold stressed manatees and sea turtles. We were also called out recently to retrieve a pygmy sperm whale that was unfortunately already deceased.

The Ask Shamu Team
www.SeaWorld.org

hmm well no real answer eh? Great that they are rescuing and rehabilating animals, but my opionion esp with when u read "vast majority of our whales and dolphins were born at our parks" ahhh dnt bloody breed them, they belong ina bloody cage!!

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Sal the 1st — Fri, 26 Feb 2010 13:43:54 GMT

well apologies if I sensed something that wasnt there

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Anonymous — Fri, 26 Feb 2010 13:33:14 GMT

[quote user="loopylou711"]

Well I have emailed so we shall see if they get back to me. I personally think "rescuing" of these creatures and rehabilitating (sp) is unfair to the animal and i think let it take its chances in the wild, better that than a lifetime of being somebodys entertainment and being stuck in a tank!!

Dippy, personally I don't see the attitude, i respect stephBs opinions as am sure she respects mine.

[/quote]

Yeah totally! Not sure where there was attitude! Just listing off details out of my head and crap at forming sentences that are eloquentand candy coated!! lol i just type it like i hear it in my head. no attitude here! :D

I'm very interested in what you hear back Lou, i used to be really into all this when i was younger. but i just don't follow it much anymore here in the UK. I totally despise Zoos, but I just never really saw a lot of the aquariums as the same. Some are totally, but some are not and are very up to date with rehabilitation and the best care possible. I think they tried to release 'Willy' aka Keiko and it was unsuccessful, died of pneumonia and beached. :( prolly would have lived longer in captivity with a job! It's a very contriversal subject and i totally agree and see where you are coming from. But some of these animals are born in captivity and know no different.

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Nikki Graef — Fri, 26 Feb 2010 12:01:28 GMT

Ive swam with sealions in the wild in galapagos islands, it was amazing they were fantastic, playful and brilliant.

A friend of mine did the same thing and got bitten by a bull seal but thats the risk you take with wild animals, i quite often go diving with sharks and i know they could attack if they wanted to but id much rather see them in the wild than in tanks

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

loopylou711 — Fri, 26 Feb 2010 11:58:11 GMT

[quote user="Vicky SVN"]

[quote user="loopylou711"]I personally think "rescuing" of these creatures and rehabilitating (sp) is unfair to the animal and i think let it take its chances in the wild, better that than a lifetime of being somebodys entertainment and being stuck in a tank!! [/quote]

I think i tend to agree with this. No tank is ever going to be big enough to properly accommodate these magnificent creatures.

Has anyone every seen polar bears in captivity? I saw them at Berlin zoo. I wanted to cry, it was heartbreaking One was stood swaying back and forth, poor poor creatures.

[/quote]

The polar bear in edinburgh was moved to there new park in the highlands. My mum was up there the other day and said the polar bear was pacing up and down. They reckon cos it can smell the sheep! I just tihnk animals should be left in the wild and if people want to see them then they should see them in their enviroment! It's the cirlce of life, animals will die, humans don't need to play god and try to rescue them for the supposed greater good!!

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Vicky RVN — Fri, 26 Feb 2010 11:30:00 GMT

I think i tend to agree with this. No tank is ever going to be big enough to properly accommodate these magnificent creatures.

Has anyone every seen polar bears in captivity? I saw them at Berlin zoo. I wanted to cry, it was heartbreaking One was stood swaying back and forth, poor poor creatures.

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

loopylou711 — Fri, 26 Feb 2010 10:56:34 GMT

Dippy, personally I don't see the attitude, i respect stephBs opinions as am sure she respects mine.

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Diane Westwood — Fri, 26 Feb 2010 10:07:19 GMT

CORKY - info from WDCS

Corky - 40 Years Imprisoned. We Owe Her A Way Out!

Friday 11th December marked the 40th anniversary of a young female orca being taken from her family in the waters off British Columbia, Canada,to become a captive orca performing tricks to amuse people around the world. She was given the name CORKY. Today, Corky is the longest surviving orca in captivity. Fifty-four of the 56 orcas captured alive for the aquarium industry from the Northeast Pacific have already passed away, but Corky, along with Lolita at the Miami Seaquarium,continues circling a concrete tank at Sea World in San Diego far awayfrom the waters that were once her home.

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Sal the 1st — Fri, 26 Feb 2010 09:57:00 GMT

well said

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

dinkyd — Fri, 26 Feb 2010 09:41:53 GMT

[quote user="loopylou711"]

[quote user="StephB"]

[quote user="Diane Westwood"]

Steph, have you got the names/locations of the 'rescued' orcas as opposed to the ones taken from the wild or bred in captivity? I would be really interested.

[/quote]

I don't have any current ones but you could possibly contact SeaWorld or the Atlanta Aquarium. I used to know a lot more about it when I was in highschool as I did some reports on it and had contacts with Green Peace.

http://www.seaworld.org/ask-shamu/faq.htm

[/quote]

Theres what i am off to do. Although i am sure they jst give me a story about not being able to provide the information and what not. But we shall see!!

[/quote]

Why would they fob you off?You find the places who genuinely rescue marine animals and are very big on conservation - as is Seaworld- are very proud of the work they do and very open about the conservation work they do-so I would be disappointed if they fobbed you off!

As to the attiitude i did detect that to and think everyone needs to remember we all have our opinions and its how we put them across to others that has to be counted.

This is a very very tragic accident and I feel awful for all parties involved.Americans are very very high up with there health and safety so doubt there was anything wrong in that respect.This just highlights wild animals are just that.Wild-no matter what training has been instilled in them and how much a bond has been formed between the trainer and animal.

As horrible as it sounds......At least the trainer has died doing something she adored - her job.

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Anonymous — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 23:26:39 GMT

[quote user="loopylou711"]

[quote user="StephB"]

[quote user="Diane Westwood"]

Steph, have you got the names/locations of the 'rescued' orcas as opposed to the ones taken from the wild or bred in captivity? I would be really interested.

[/quote]

http://www.seaworld.org/ask-shamu/faq.htm

[/quote]

Theres what i am off to do. Although i am sure they jst give me a story about not being able to provide the information and what not. But we shall see!!

[/quote]

Corky has quite the rescue team I believe, you could have a search round for Corky's rescue pages and maybe contact them. Most of the 'rescue' cases are ones that have been rescued from bad places of captivity, not from injury or illness in the wild. I think Corky is the oldest I know of and she was around when I was a kid... so 30 some years now. :)

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

loopylou711 — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 23:08:24 GMT

[quote user="StephB"]

[quote user="Diane Westwood"]

Steph, have you got the names/locations of the 'rescued' orcas as opposed to the ones taken from the wild or bred in captivity? I would be really interested.

[/quote]

http://www.seaworld.org/ask-shamu/faq.htm

[/quote]

Theres what i am off to do. Although i am sure they jst give me a story about not being able to provide the information and what not. But we shall see!!

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Anonymous — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 23:02:11 GMT

[quote user="Diane Westwood"]

Steph, have you got the names/locations of the 'rescued' orcas as opposed to the ones taken from the wild or bred in captivity? I would be really interested.

[/quote]

http://www.seaworld.org/ask-shamu/faq.htm

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

loopylou711 — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 22:34:15 GMT

[quote user="Diane Westwood"]

Steph, have you got the names/locations of the 'rescued' orcas as opposed to the ones taken from the wild or bred in captivity? I would be really interested.

[/quote]

mee to actually!

Attitude sal? a mere healthy discussion!!

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Sal the 1st — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 22:18:00 GMT

do I detect a bit of 'attitude' creeping into this thread?

its another 2 days to the full moon - so what gives?

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Diane Westwood — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 22:04:27 GMT

Steph, have you got the names/locations of the 'rescued' orcas as opposed to the ones taken from the wild or bred in captivity? I would be really interested.

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Doolally — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 21:57:55 GMT

I agree that sometimes they can't be released and they do need enrichment which the training obviously does for them....I'm sure the trainers know they're working in a very dangerous job and this unfortunately will remind them of that

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

loopylou711 — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 21:49:57 GMT

Certain animal parks in europe let u swim with sealions is what i meant. Why you'd want to i dnt no why?

Just my opinion when i say animals shouldnt be kept in captivity! Am with caro and saying no more, have made my opinion perfectly clear!

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Anonymous — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 21:38:43 GMT

Agreed, I don't believe they should be taken out of their habitat either, and neither do SeaWorld. But foreign countries (particularly Asian ones) like to capture them and put them in parks and places like SeaWorld rescue them from there. OR if they are damaged by fishery boats and are reported SeaWorld takes them on and rehabilitates them.

Swimming with sea lions in the wild would be just stupid.. are you sure you're not confusing them with manatees? Manatees actually enjoy human company! believe it or not. As do dolphins. Like I said I think whales are big enough to say no if they don't wish to do something. They are all very well looked after and seem to enjoy the stimulation. They are very playful intelligent creatures and tend to have very active lifestyles in the wild. To then rescue them and put them in a smaller living space with no 'entertainment' (i.e. fish swimming, other animals, plant life, birds, travel, storms, etc....) would be even crueler. They would just go mad and blow their brains!! Who knows that whale that attacked that trainer might have been bored, since the recession the park is quieter and I'm sure their are less shows and activities for the animals there. He probably just thought he was playing with his friend...

[quote user="loopylou711"]

[quote user="StephB"]

[quote user="Caro Laithwaite"]

There was a period after a trainer got killed when there was an embargo placed by pretty much every orca owner that only 2 trainers permitted / session If l remember rightly a trainer was pushed against the wall and held there untill drowned.

I do not mind rehab but disagree with all the shows that dolphins/orcas and other members of the familys do and keeping them in captivity feel that better to take their chance in the oceans they are to intelligent to keep as they are.

[/quote]

It was my understanding that the activities for the whales was to keep them happy in the captive units and keep them healthy. As the units are very different than the normal environment in which they would be traveling to great depths, distances and breaching to their heart's delight. I doubt the animals are forced to do anything. Similar to horses, when they don't work they go a bit mad and get ill and when they don't want to do something... they don't.

[/quote]

Well leave them in the wild and let them be "happy" and metally stimulated that way! Am with caro, let nature take its course and give them the best chance that way! I don'tthink getting them to do tricks or perform is needed. Esp people who swim with dolphins or sea lions in certain places. Anyways just my opinion...

[/quote]

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Doolally — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 21:00:24 GMT

Hmmm...

Killer whales are still very much a wild animal, and whatever anyones opinion on keeping them in captivity, the people working with them have to realise they are working with a huge, wild animal.

Horses can be extremely dangerous, and they're less than half the size of a whale and have been domesticated for thousands of years, so I think working that closely with a killer whale is asking for trouble

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Emma Bartlett — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 20:08:27 GMT

I do wonder what people are actually thinking when working with animals of this size....do they really think that they are ever going to 100% tame, even ones that have been born into captivity from once wild parents?

I have dealt with a few cats, born to feral parents, and have thought my life is in serious danger as cat launches itself at me from its basket.....one huge "apparently friendly" ginger cat flew at me once resulting in a trip to A&E for multiple bites

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Caro Laithwaite VN — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 16:16:45 GMT

I am going to ignore the rest of this thread so l do not stamp on toes as l can see it coming on so please be aware l won't post any more replies on it to avoid complications

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Caro Laithwaite VN — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 16:15:51 GMT

Yes agree with the comment on impossible but the thing is that to often things are done because someone can do them not with the future in mind. Bottom line is money and it is excellent publicity for whoever to have such and such for rehab. The reality is death would have been better.

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

Nikki Graef — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 15:56:07 GMT

They spent millions and years rehabilitating an orca somewhere like iceland i think then released it and it died a few months later, apparently it was too tame and couldnt look after itself. Unfortunately i think its almost impossible to release some captive animals if theyve been captive for a long time

Re: Killer whale kills trainer!

loopylou711 — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 15:41:15 GMT

[quote user="StephB"]

[quote user="Caro Laithwaite"]

[/quote]