What would you do?

Re: What would you do?

Sally Howe — Wed, 09 Sep 2009 15:58:53 GMT

I've had it with a cat I took on with a simple fracture. Vet said she had fitted loads of external fix's and wanted to show another vet how to do it so I agreed.

Dispite being in a crate, 2 days later the external fix fell off, the bone had fractured further, but the intramedullary pin was still in. Well only for a week!!! then that fell out. I wouldn't let them near him after that and took advice from a vet I previously worked with.

Re: What would you do?

Kim Buckley — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 18:45:19 GMT

We've had a specialist come in and do ops for us before. Works quite well as the other vets can watch and learn.

Re: What would you do?

Fiona Leathers — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 14:18:06 GMT

There is a company up here in Scotland, who go from practice to practice doing ops that the vet can't do. They will also train vets whilst carrying out the operation, so the vets get hands on experience too. Unfortunately the vet who runs this business doesn't hold a certificate, so again you're left with the whole referral thing & offering best care. But its a very good idea!

Re: What would you do?

Mac Feather — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 11:17:20 GMT

[quote user="sal the 1st"]or how about they refer the patient to a specialist and ask if they can watch the op?[/quote]

Great idea. Sounds like a good option.

Re: What would you do?

les punton — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 11:11:51 GMT

i worked with a fab nurse who if she didnt agree she would be able to change the vets mind but in a positive way to make them think that it was their idea such as 'the animal is insured shall I arranged referal as we have never done this op before?'

I dont have this talent unfortunatley!

good luck x

Re: What would you do?

Sal the 1st — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 22:00:50 GMT

or how about they refer the patient to a specialist and ask if they can watch the op?

Re: What would you do?

Saskia Quinn — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:49:05 GMT

[quote user="Charlotte says smile"]

I didnt get involved as I didnt agree with it so I am unsure how the owners were.I know that the dog is healthy now.

I just wondered what the best way of telling the vet you didnt agree with them was. I luckily didnt have to say anything to the vet this time, i did speak to HVN but I am hoping I am not in this situation again but just incase I would like your advise on how best to deal with it. As I find it hard to get my opinions out in an educated maner when under pressure I just get all nervous and cant speak properly

[/quote]

Difficult question Charlotte, if it was me, I would say something along the lines of, 'well, if you are not confident enough to feel you can successfully do this surgery, the fact that the pet is insured maybe it would be better to go for referral? Of course I know you are keen and want experience, but I am sure there will be other cases in which you can get that experience, and even better, (name of vet) could be here to guide you?'

Worth a try

Re: What would you do?

Charlotte says smile — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:38:30 GMT

I didnt get involved as I didnt agree with it so I am unsure how the owners were.I know that the dog is healthy now.

Re: What would you do?

Kerry Spain — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:34:28 GMT

[quote user="Charlotte says smile"]

It was insured so could easily been referred.

I know for certain that she has not observed this surgery before and has very minimal experience in that surgery which is why I felt so uncomfortable with it.

[/quote]

Sorry this was posted as I was replying so yeah deffo send it for referral and if you den't feel comfy then say no.

Re: What would you do?

Saskia Quinn — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:33:53 GMT

[quote user="Bouncyfi"]

In my opinion, with the patient being insured, the vet has stepped over the mark completely, it should have gone to someone with the skill and certification. AS an owner I would have been extremely pissed off if this went badly and would be looking for blood!

[/quote]

I am in complete agreement with Fi here

Re: What would you do?

Fiona Leathers — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:31:38 GMT

Re: What would you do?

Kerry Spain — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:27:21 GMT

should just add the cat and vet are both doing very well

Re: What would you do?

Kerry Spain — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:26:55 GMT

There are some really arrogant vets out there who just think that they can take on the world so it depends on the individual to be honests. If its being done to aid the magnitude of the ego then NO, I wouldn't help

However I suppose they have to learn somehow and so long as someone else is there to mentour then I'm all for supporting them. One of our vets has just done a few thyroidectomies and he was dead nervous about doing the first one but he was doing it to further his knowledge and help the cat and the client. So in my eyes it was done for the right reasons. My boss was watching the whole thing and was there to guide him through the surgery, which was successful

Re: What would you do?

Charlotte says smile — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:24:15 GMT

It was insured so could easily been referred.

I know for certain that she has not observed this surgery before and has very minimal experience in that surgery which is why I felt so uncomfortable with it.

Re: What would you do?

Nick Shackleton — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:20:42 GMT

I agree with Fi!

If you can't referr due to cost then at least try and get some advice from you local referral centre am sure they would be happy to advise!

Re: What would you do?

Fiona Leathers — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:18:02 GMT

If the vet has no experience in doing this surgery, then they should refer, unless the owner can not afford referral and the owner understands the vet has no experience in this field.

If the vet does not make their experience clear to the owner - they can be sued for not offering the best care to the animal. It is down to the vet though, its their reputation thats on the line.

I have heard of a practice who are now refusing to refer anything to anyone. The management have decided to keep everything in house. This is fine BUT none of their staff have any training or certificates in anything. One dog (insured) had a broken leg, fixed badly once by one vet, fixed badly a second time by another, owner went elsewhere for a second opinion, who immediately reffered to a orthopaedic surgeon, who stated the operations were botched from start to finish. I think the owners are going to take it much further! As they should!

Re: What would you do?

Saskia Quinn — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:14:02 GMT

In all fairness Charlotte, I dont think any vet would (or should) do any surgical procedure they are not happy to do.

I have worked with vets who had to do a certain surgical procedure for the first time in their career, now they may have been lucky enough to assist with such a procedure before, but this is the first time they attempt it on their own - their lies the difference.

In these cases, whether it is totally new to them, or they have assisted with it before, they have spent a lot of time talking to vet colleagues about it and reading up on it, all in their own time I may add

I wouldnt think any surgeon would enter lightly into such a situation.

Re: What would you do?

Nick Shackleton — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:12:47 GMT

Personally I would refuse to help and I think you are well within your right!

I have refused to help vets with certain procedures such as tail docking, dew claw removals, skin tucks, using certain drugs....

Out of curiosity what op are they planning on doing??? feel free to PM if you dont wanna say on here