Please help!advice on VN training!

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Ems — Mon, 24 Aug 2009 13:02:46 GMT

The RCVS has a lot of good info about GCSE's etc. Check out the link:

http://www.rcvs.org.uk/Templates/Internal.asp?NodeID=89961

Hope this helps, all the best!

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Nick Shackleton — Sat, 15 Aug 2009 14:08:34 GMT

Lisa is there not a box to tick to say that you dont want them to contact your current employer without your say so, if not just just write next to it or in the covering letter

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

typolisa — Sat, 15 Aug 2009 14:05:31 GMT

On the CAW application form they ask for 2 references - one to be your most recent employer. If I do this and put my current manager while I'm still working there they wont contact her without speaking to me first will they? I'd hate for that to be the way she found out I was considering leaving!

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

typolisa — Tue, 11 Aug 2009 09:38:11 GMT

Thanks Deemus, that's actually very helpful. If some want experience and some don't there's no point me stressing about how much I have!!! It will be the right amount for somewhere! I am 100% going to finish the course so I can safely put it on my CV and start applying whenever I want (which I feel is going to be a long and demoralising process!)

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Angiy Michael — Tue, 11 Aug 2009 03:33:20 GMT

With regard to the response to my saying i have been feeling I have reached the end of the road in this profession I am perfectly entitled to say this if this is how I feel...you ask why I don't leave the job if that is how I feel...I am actually in the process of doing exactly that so this not just a case of having a moan and doing nothing about it. Of course i don't feel my life has ended at 31..far from it ! But after 11 years in this job I feel I am long overdue to leave and as I have had failry extensive experience of practice during that time I feel my opinion in this regard is just as valid as those who remain happy in the profession for the remainder of their working lives..we are all differen't ..I am just putting forward my standpoint at the point I am now at...and my point regarding nurses 5 years qualification is a valid one...we do struggle to keep nurses for any long period of time and it is time the veterinary profession asked itself honestly why this is .

Anyone who knows me over the years on these forums will know that I have always actively helped and encouraged prospective student nurses... but in order to help inform people it it s always key they have as many points of view..as mine has changed over the years it is quite possible many other nurses may also reach the point I find myself at...just as it is possible they won't ...I am not going to promote the profession as all roses as it is important to be able to make an informed decision as a prospective student and plenty of people have put across the positive side, myself included many times in the past on these forums.

I do not have some high flying aspirations when I refer to where I wanted to be at 31..... I just didn't think I would have spent have a 1/3 of my life working excessive hours for poor pay and struggling to have any sort of standard of living with little or no recognition for the hardwork and dedication put in over the years. When you dedicate yourself to something wholeheartedly and the rewards are so few it does after many years become dispiriting. Also intellectually sometimes people decide they just need a change or maybe a bit of skill stretching ..rather than rarely getting to put what they have learnt into practice. I would be fascinated to see how many of VN's here will still be in the job and happy in 11 years...I have seen so many come and go during my time in practice and I have even been one of the ones who was mazed anyone could feel the way I do. I have also met some who have been in practice for years and who are still happy and motivated..but I have to say those people are pretty few and far between...it shouldn't be this way and it is a crying shame but there it is. I have spent a good number of years fighting for the profession and fighting for change and I hope to continue to do so so that nurses in the future a welcomed into a profession where lack of pay and skills progression is a thing of the past...but I can't do it anymore as a full-time job..it wears you down with the battle.

Lisa, thanks for your response I am glad you realised I wasn't trying to be mean..I have spent years positively encouraging people that are keen to join the profession...now I find myself having reached this point and having seen other here before I thought it was inportant to share the other side of the coin. . On the plus sides as you have discovered it is fairly common for people to join the profession in their mid to late 20's and I have also known several in their 30's and a few in their 40's ...one of the good things about the job is common sense and life skills and passion are key and age is largely irrelevant if you are starting out with this positive attitude .Lots of luck

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

les punton — Mon, 10 Aug 2009 18:21:30 GMT

i think that working for a week free is a good idea, it doesnt only give your potential employers an idea of you it give you an idea of them!

We had a sat girl who if we had a nurse down we would phone her and she was very capable of restraining animals and was more than willing to clean up after us as we went. she was very competant and was very well respected and liked. it showed she was keen and willing to get mucked in and i know if a job came up she would be 1st in line

any experience is invaluable x

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Deemus — Mon, 10 Aug 2009 18:19:12 GMT

Hello again Lisa,

I hesitate to say too much about your diploma in small animal care and behaviour. It ultimately depends on the practice you're applying to. Some would prefer little to no experience so they can train you the way they want to for their needs without coming up against too many umm resistances. If I can say that of course.

Mind you on the other side of the coin, if you mention it in your CV and you don't end up completing it does that show that you're a quitter?

Sorry to sit so firmly on the fence but it's something I really can't answer for you. When I interview, I tend to pay more attention to the person in front of me rather than their CV. We're such a small practice that personality counts for a lot. I mean I spend more time with my girls than I do with my bf! So to suss out any potential new members of staff, I invite them to meet me and have an informal chat, meet everyone else and have a tour of the practice. This way I believe that most candidates are a little more chilled than they are on a formal interview. If they're successful (ie I like what they have to say) then they are invited back for a formal interview with boss man and myself.

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

les punton — Mon, 10 Aug 2009 18:05:54 GMT

Hey lissy

I was 1 grade off from having 5 gcse's (i got a d in science) however during my gcses and a levels I was working voluntary at a local practice (done this for 4 years) then went to college to do animal management dip.

once i passed this I got the yellow pages out and wrote to every practice within a 60mile radius. I only got a couple of replies but did get an interview and got the job as a trainee. the practice took on 1st year trainees as they were cheap(i have known practices that will train you on a contract that you leave when you qualify!) I now work back at the practice I done voluntary work at.

It may have changed since I done it but I certainly did not have the grades (but my diplma may have helped) good luck with everything

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Snowb — Mon, 10 Aug 2009 17:15:18 GMT

[quote user="lisajane"]

Friends and family are telling me not to. They think its mad im even considering giving a place a week's free trial. But with the recession on and companies looking to save money, i have to have something to offer them.

[/quote]

Before i got my place the practice asked me to work free for a week, i was more than happy to do it! 12 years on i'm still nursing, and not getting paid for a week didn't hurt to much!

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

typolisa — Mon, 10 Aug 2009 16:15:18 GMT

Oh my goodness albatross. 37 TPs for 3 years :( That’s more than I was hoping you’d say! Thanks for all the websites, I’ve checked a lot of them out today and started filling in the CAW application form.

Hours sound great – thanks all. I think anyone who went into a job like this would be willing to stay when needed. If a VN could walk out and go home when an animal needed help I think they are in the wrong career.

I would definitely offer a weeks trial, what’s 1 weeks pay!? Nothing in the long run! If it gets you noticed and you look keen I say definitely go for it!

Do people think it is worth me finishing my home learning “small animal care and behaviour” diploma and doing more volunteering before I start applying or should I just get on with it?! Could it be the difference between getting the job and not? Deemus?

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

albatross — Sat, 08 Aug 2009 16:12:20 GMT

[quote user="Lisa Simmonds"]

I applied for 37 TP's inside Kent - some on at least three different occasions over three years. I applied for 6 direct adverts outside of Kent.

I joined Rigvets, Salus Vets(now under a different name), CAW recruitment, and another one whose name I can't remember off the top of my head - all job agencies, and all returned a great fat zero of interviews. I wanetd to join another but we argued over what constituted an "experienced" or qualified nurse. To them experienced was a 2nd year SVN...

I regularly searched : this site, vetclick, vetpro, animaljobs, jobcentreplus, local newspapers online, student or trainee vet nurse jobs via search engines, trovit, gumtree, and others which I haven't got a note of where I am at the moment.

The only time I got interviews was from adverts on this site - good old vetnurse!, and that's where I have finally found my placement (albeit maybe not as long term as I'd thought/hoped but that's another story possibly for the future.)

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

lisajane — Sat, 08 Aug 2009 13:34:50 GMT

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Deemus — Sat, 08 Aug 2009 12:30:19 GMT

Lisajane,

Who's telling you not to? The practices themselves or friends/family/job centre?

I have to say I was really impressed by the girl who offered - she's back for a formal interview next week. Even if the practices don't want or think a weeks trial isn't necessary then you've tried and it will hopefully click in somone's brain about how much you want to do it.

Good luck with everything :)

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Deemus — Sat, 08 Aug 2009 12:28:24 GMT

Hey Lisa,

Not sure about the job centre, she'd left a job only the previous week or so.

Don't worry about sounding gushy or insane, just think about why you want to do it and try to put in into words. Don't think too hard tho or you may end up reading them an essay ;)

Just for the record, "I want to work with animals" is something that we've heard a thousand times before so be a little original, believe me, you'll stand out more :)

As for the average working week, at our place, we have 3 nurses to cover the hours of 8am - 7pm. Usually the shifts are 8-4, 9-5 and 10:30-7pm. We no longer do out of hours (thank god) but the weekends are equally shared. Sat is 8-4 and Sun is 10-11. We've all had it thought when that emergency walks through the door 5 minutes before your shift ends. Your heart sinks but you suck it up and do it anyway. I'm really lucky in that all of my girls are like this :)

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Nick Shackleton — Sat, 08 Aug 2009 10:20:20 GMT

hey lisa hours depends on where you work, but generally 35 - 40 hrs per week. I currently work a mix of 8hr and 9hr days, but don't have to do any nights. If you have to work nites these shifts can extend to 12hrs!!!!

Bur every practice is different, so before you accept a job make sure you know what shifts you are going to be expected to work

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

typolisa — Sat, 08 Aug 2009 00:57:31 GMT

Samantha and Albatross how many training practises did you apply to when you were looking for a student place? Also Albatross what are all these job websites you’re on? I don’t want to miss anything :)

Kathryn - I have considered the money. It’s the only reason I didn’t do this years ago as it will be, from what you say, at best, eventually, only about 70% of what I get now!! But I can’t waste my whole life doing something pointless just for money. I think it will be worth it.

Angiy Michael I feel I have reached the end of the road in my current career and I’ve only been in my job 2 1/2 years! I currently have no chance of progression and it’s very unchallenging. I think I would be really happy if I could do anything 11 years before I wanted a change!!
And I guess I can always go back to what I do now if I want to in the future. Thanks for giving an honest assesment of the job.

lisajane - that shows amazing commitment, but I am very unhappy to hear that that is necessary to get a job :( I wish you the best of luck finding somewhere - you deserve it.

Deemus - that first girl sounds like a great candidate ;) Forced there by the job centre?! I will definitely be enthusiastic if nothing else. I’m more worried I’ll come across gushy and insane as if I get as far as an interview I’ll want it so much I’ll say something stupid! I would definitely offer a weeks free trial if that’s what it takes. I just want a foot in the door!!

Everyone!!

27 seems to be the age a lot of people start! I’m taking that as a good sign - along with how many Lisas there are on this site!!

How long is an average (if there is such a thing!) working day as a VN? Or is it more shifts? If so how many hours a week?

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Avril Louise Jackson RVN — Sat, 08 Aug 2009 00:05:10 GMT

[quote user="Angiy Michael"]I personally feel I have reached the end of the road in this job as there is little structured progression once you hit a certain level of experience..the pay ( and I get more than average) is also pretty dire still for the amount of training and responsibility, the anti-social hours etc., This def not where I wanted to be aged 31 ..[/quote]

Whilst I agree that the pay is pretty crap, I don't agree with notion that this profession becomes a dead end at a certain point with no progressive possibilities. It depends where your priorities lie and what you want out of life and also how you aim to go about it. I can't understand you saying "this is not where I wanted to be aged 31" as if 31 is the age of scrap heap status!! Some people are older than 31 and wanting to get into this profession. If it's not where you want to be then why are you still doing it? There's so many people who do WANT to be doing this. I think my glass is half full and I know that this job can open gateways to new countries and careers, not just new practices/towns/counties. I think that if you believe in yourself and know what you want you can achieve it. Yes this job is shit at times, but it's also absolutely amazing and aged 30 I'm exactly where I want to be and in a better place than I was when I was 21 doing a degree in psychology that has had no influence on any part of my life! I work hard in this career but I feel satisfied i it and I hope to represent the profession in raising awareness of what we do :)

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

lisajane — Fri, 07 Aug 2009 22:42:09 GMT

Deemus, that's exactly what i was thinking off doing. Offering them a week's free trial but people are telling me not to. But i want it so bad, so screw them, il do whatever it takes.

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Deemus — Fri, 07 Aug 2009 18:58:21 GMT

OMG! I'm horrified that you've gone to the lengths of losing weight to try and find work. It's amazing how a comment like that can stay with you for years and years.

Anyhow, just wanted to say good luck with finding a job and a placement. When I got into it (13 years ago) it was still really hard to get into. You may need to find something to makes you stand out from the crowd.

I have recently been interviewing for a Veterinary Nursing Assisstant as our place will soon cease to be a TP. The pros of the training nurses have been totally outweighed by the amount of time, effort and paper that the course takes! With the recent people I have been interviewing, I was astounded by the different levels of enthusiasm shown. When I wasked her about why she wanted the job she replied "I left my last job coz my boss is a bitch and I need a job closer to home". I asked her if she had always wanted to work with animals and she said "ah, yeah, I suppose". Hmmmm, not quite the answer I was looking for.

The one who stood out from the crowd for me was a girl who had got loads of experience off her own back and went so far as to offer us a weeks free trial as it were to see how she found it. I have to admit that this really impressed me and we're taking her up on the offer. I hope it works out, she seemed lovely.

Best of luck with everything :)

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

lisajane — Fri, 07 Aug 2009 10:38:13 GMT

Im 27 too and always wanted to do veterinary nursing. Im in ireland though, but it i don't think it makes a difference cause its still difficult to get work.

There is a course im interested in and its a 6 hour drive from where i live, with work experience once a week. Considering its a 6hour drive, i think il be better off moving and searching for work close to the college. But with so many other students doing the same, it will be hard. I have started to do some voluntary work at a shelter, so im hoping that will tell them im interested and that and the distance learning course in animal care.

Im hoping to start the course next year, so i have a year to sort myself out and find work. Is there anything else i could possibly do that will make veterinary practices interested in taking me on? (I have already lost 5 stone in weight, cause i heard once that fat people always finds it harder, cause people do judge them-thats how dedicated i am to this).

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Kathryn Welsh — Fri, 07 Aug 2009 08:33:39 GMT

Would agree with the above post out of the 15 of us that graduated and qualified Sept 2008, less than half of us are still in practice!! Some have gone to teaching whilst others have gone on to something else all together! And personally i can't see myelf staying in nursing for any long than a couple more years!

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Angiy Michael — Fri, 07 Aug 2009 00:52:47 GMT

Hope you have some success finding a placement job. Do give the decision some thought..the job isn't what most people think it is..plus it varies so much from practice to practice...some places the nurses just do clinical work and hands on nursing others they can be little more than glorified over trained cleaners and receptionists...sad that this still happens but true. Also def give the financial side some thought..I note you feel you are in a dead end job at 27..I have been vet nursing for 11 years and am 31 and whilst it is certainly varied and more interesting than lots of jobs..I personally feel I have reached the end of the road in this job as there is little structured progression once you hit a certain level of experience..the pay ( and I get more than average) is also pretty dire still for the amount of training and responsibility, the anti-social hours etc., This def not where I wanted to be aged 31 .. there are strong and sadly unresolved issues as to why this profession cannot retain many nurses who have been qualified more than 5 years or why we don't see many nurses in their 40's and beyond. Loads hot a point where they give up and leave due to the lack of progression available, lack of recognition and poor pay, Not trying to be a misery guts but I think it is important to always hear the good and bad sides. Whatever you decide I wish you every success, and if you decide it is for you go after it with a passion . Lots of luck X

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

lissy27 — Fri, 07 Aug 2009 00:33:01 GMT

[quote user="lissy27"]

Aww, thanks for all the replies guys, you really are all a helpful bunch!

Well, i feel much better knowing its possible - whatever your age! There seems to be a alot of difference in the ways you have all got into it though.

Unfortunatley, and quite embarassingly!!, i dont have the required GCSESwhen i was at school all i wanted to do was leave and concentrate on competing my horse at the time and work at the stables where i kept himsounds stupid now but i guess ive grown up. lol.

I did get a good grade in English and have since done a CLAIT course, Funny thing is i didnt enjoy studying at school but i love learning and researching now - im very involved with the breed of dog i keep and show and spend hours researching health issues and trawling through books on genetics, i find it fasinating, just wish i was like that years ago!

Anyway, I find it really worrying and quite dreadful that some courses are recognised by the RCVS but not the VNACs! That must be dreadful for some of you guys that have spent so much time on a course and then find out it doesnt count!! EEK! Im worried now!

Surely, VNACs must except the courses that are listed on the RVCS website? (i.e BTEC animal care diplomas)

So , im thinking now that i need to get the relevant qualifications before i even start appyling...but what to take is the question!? My mind is boggling and ive been racking my brains with what i can fit in around my work at present...i just cannot afford to leave work totally and do a full time BTEC ( I have a mortgage!!) so...if i can manage to take GCSEs again part time college whilst still at work do you think this would suffice? and does it have to be GCSE or can it be the equavilent? as my work offer city and guilds level 2 in literacy and numeracy which is apparently the equalivent to a GCSE A-C level.

Thank you soo much,

LISA SIMMONDS - Hi, yes you do seem to be in the same boat as me and the same age!lol Coincedently my name is Lisa too, just changed it for my user name!Ha!

Good luck with your searching too. I dont know where in the UK you are but ive found out Warwickshire college are holding a vet nurse training taster day in Nov which sounds good, its not just geared up for peeps that may train with them, but its for peeps in general that are interested. £50 for the day which i dont think is bad.

[/quote]Can anyone anser my questions regarding the GCSES above pleaseee? Sorry for the 101 questions!!

I should be ok on min wage and manage to pay my mortgage , just wont have much 'leisure' money lol, but ive already been saving for some time now and cut back on my little luxuries so i will be able to pay myself a top up wage out of my savings once im training! Thats the plan anyway!

I just wouldnt be able to leave work totally to do a course such as a full time BTEC thats my prob at min - what i can do to get myself the necessary qualification (s) to even try to apply for a trainee position!

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Kathryn Welsh — Thu, 06 Aug 2009 14:56:36 GMT

Hey, i did the degree route and although we only had limited placement periods finding a space was still hard. But amoung our course a couple of the people on it were mature with morgages and children and they came out top of the class as they were more determined to make a go of it! I know for the students at my current practice the wage is minimum wage, with a slight pay rise once passed the level 2, and then up2 £17,000 a yr once qualified. So really consider the fact the money is not good and all on her would agree that we don't do this job for the money!! Good luck with it all x x

Re: Please help!advice on VN training!

Lisa Whitehouse — Thu, 06 Aug 2009 13:49:49 GMT

hi Lissy,

The practice i am moving to as head nurse have actualy started taking on mature student vn's as they are usually more grounded & responsible so there are placements available out there just persevere.

good luck