Furlough scheme

RE: Furlough scheme

Sal the 1st — Sun, 17 Jan 2021 15:54:14 GMT

[quote userid="5723" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/legal-legislation-issues/32118/furlough-scheme/176759#176759"]Its tough with children at home yes it was our choice to have children but still it's no picnic looking after children I would much prefer to keep working[/quote]

and I understand that. In fairness the issue of working parents hasn't affected me greatly this time round. I appreciate that things are difficult for working parents but they aren't any easier for those left behind or the employers and in trying to accommodate everybody elses demands these are the people that get forgotten about . I am not bitter about this as some seem to think I am just trying to even it up and let some of you know that you aren't the only ones who have problems as a result of this decision it impacts everybody in the practice so as difficult as it is for you it isn't any easier for anybody else either.

RE: Furlough scheme

Tanya Traill — Sat, 16 Jan 2021 20:59:47 GMT

Just to add I have a child and I worked the entire pandemic so far and will continue to keep working.

There seems to be a lot of animosity towards nurses with children in some of the clinics.

I never arrive late or leave early because of my childcare as me and my husband share our childcare problems equally.

We have had no nursery, no family help over the pandemic and it has been incredibly tough but we both pulled together.

In the last couple of months we have moved house during the pandemic so we are now closer to family so we can now use one grandparent to help out with childcare that helps slightly but it's not perfect thankfully my husband can help juggle his two jobs as he works from home at the moment because of the pandemic.

My husband has taken the toll on his work side instead as he knew that I was needed at work.

I don't really understand why some of you seem so angry at the nurses with children in your clinic.

Its tough with children at home yes it was our choice to have children but still it's no picnic looking after children I would much prefer to keep working .

Maybe a chat with your head nurse/management if you feel so upset/angry about how you have been treated.

RE: Furlough scheme

Sal the 1st — Sun, 10 Jan 2021 20:10:46 GMT

[quote userid="2637" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/legal-legislation-issues/32118/furlough-scheme/176744#176744"]Pointing the finger at your colleagues who have different circumstances will NEVER change the system, you need to be the force for positive change and change the system[/quote]

maybe not - but then neither will the continued abuse of goodwill that many of us who fill in the gaps at the drop of a hat put up with either

RE: Furlough scheme

Ben Ogden — Sat, 09 Jan 2021 10:37:20 GMT

I think that’s key, working cohesively to find a solution. Why does there have to be an us and them?

Childcare issues are not your problem?

To some degree maybe not, but losing a lot of your workforce because they’ve been caught out in unprecedented times surely is your problem? These are the most unusual and for a lot frightening times, we all need to show some understanding, some care and compassion. Looking the other way is not at all supportive and adds to this horrid capitalist culture.

Being child-free (childless is the wrong term, but that’s another topic), isn’t a reason to be bitter. The way I see it, these childcare issues are no different than a colleague having to care for a sick parent, a colleague having mental health issues, a colleague needing regular hospital appointments; it’s life!

Care for these people, show compassion, because one day your circumstances may change and you will need compassion and people to lean on. You reap what you sow, so sow positivity.

You might be tired and exhausted, I get it, I was one of the ones who worked all the way through this, but when the first lockdown was lifted I was given first refusal for annual leave 2020 AND 2021, all those that chose to furlough we’re back of the line to book leave. That was to recognise my commitment and working through hard times, do you know what else I got? 2 additional days leave a personal gift from management and a genuine thank you. I’m naturally a cynic, but I appreciated these gestures.

Pointing the finger at your colleagues who have different circumstances will NEVER change the system, you need to be the force for positive change and change the system.

RE: Furlough scheme

Sal the 1st — Sat, 09 Jan 2021 10:20:15 GMT

all I can say is lucky you - but just be aware that what happens in your world isn't universal - all the wellbeing and wellness webinars in the world are not going to fix this, I need a bit more than lip service. This nurse is broken.

RE: Furlough scheme

Lucy-lu — Sat, 09 Jan 2021 09:43:37 GMT

I have not been successful with a school placement this time, as my school does not view my employment as an essential worker.

It seems such a shame that in this industry we still have so much negativity. The past few years we have been actively encouraged to take wellness and wellbeing webinars, yet it seems kind of pointless/tick box exercise if some employers still take this view.

As a team, we were extremely grateful for our remaining staff whom worked throughout Covid. We ensured that this team had holidays immediately as we all began to return. I personally advised/assisted one of our RVN's to write a statement and obtain the role as HN, (a role which I have previously have had in other practices), to praise her and recognition for her hard work and commitment.

My employer knew I had children when they employed me. I never hid them away in a dark cupboard somewhere! Yet they still employed for my skills, experience and dedication. As they have also done for other staff across the board.

Not once did I predict in my career that we would be dealing with an extreme health situation that we are, (which neither did my employers). But this is the position that we are all in, hence the furlough scheme to support businesses and employees.

RCVS guidelines actually state that we must try to our bit during this pandemic, so less client contact and stop non essential visits, so it's not 'business as usual'.

We have worked together to provide a solution at my practice. Fortunately they have more of a positive attitude towards all staff. I am proud to be part of our team and employed by them.

Stay safe everyone and less bitter.

RE: Furlough scheme

rcookieuk — Sat, 09 Jan 2021 08:38:12 GMT

Do you propose parents bring their children to work with them then?!

some vet nurses have been lucky enough to get school places in this lockdown (mine included) under the key worker scheme but not everyone has- our job role isn’t always classed as critical by the schools.

I feel really lucky to work in a practice where we all understand each other’s needs and will pull our weight when able to... I can’t help but feel it must be very toxic to work with such resentment towards colleagues and I have seen it often in other practices and this results in poor staff retention

RE: Furlough scheme

apache — Sat, 09 Jan 2021 00:44:45 GMT

[quote userid="10242" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/legal-legislation-issues/32118/furlough-scheme/176735#176735"]

And we wonder why nurses dont stay in this profession!

The current situation is very far removed from school holidays which parents are able to plan childcare for from a variety of family/friends/clubs all of which aren’t available to us at the moment!

Childcare is always a big stress when schools are closed and I was very lucky to be placed on furlough in the last lockdown. If I hadn’t been I would have had to hand my notice in and find alternative work that would fit in with looking after my children.

Im also more than happy to offer my help at other times when able to and I was well aware of how busy my colleagues were during the first lockdown.

Having staff leave would be counter intuitive though, if furloughing enables staff to be retained then it should be used.

[/quote]

I employ as many staff as I feel I 'need' to run the practice effectively and still allow holiday, sickness etc. What I cannot possibly do, for a single second, is lay off 1/3 of my workforce and expect those remaining to cope with a +50% increase in workload. RCVS has (and I think rightly) said we can continue business as normal if safe and in animals best interests. We and all the other vets I speak to are busy.

I know this is controversial - but I'm not sure your lack of childcare is my problem, or the other staff who don't have children's problem. Not wile you have maybe had months off work already on almost full pay, while we work our arse's off. I care about my staff, but I am in agreement with the corporates that believe that we need bums on seats and currently furlough is not appropriate for veterinary staff.

RE: Furlough scheme

Sal the 1st — Fri, 08 Jan 2021 23:59:06 GMT

Throughout my whole career of 30yrs+ I have always played 2nd fiddle to those with children. The furlough was just icing on the cake. Not a lot management can do if those with children wanted summer holidays with them - that time of year lets face it you aren't tripping over locums, there isn't a glut of locums at any price. The system has to be fair to everybody, and at the minute its a lot fairer to some than others.

RE: Furlough scheme

rcookieuk — Fri, 08 Jan 2021 23:44:14 GMT

That doesn’t seem fair at all, I’m surprised the holiday rota was managed so badly! More a problem with the management from the sound of it. It’s a shame because I imagine you feel resentful to those colleagues.

After the furloughed employees at my work went back those that hadnt been off were able to take holiday.

I do think the Flexi furlough system that they have now is much better than the original one. Being able to manage staff numbers day to day instead of by the 3 weeks.

I still think we would be in a much worse position now if those parents who were furloughed had needed to resign! We are certainly still very busy and need all of our team.

RE: Furlough scheme

Sal the 1st — Fri, 08 Jan 2021 23:06:24 GMT

As somebody who doesn't have children and has worked all the way through I'm sorry but the furlough scheme the first time around was not fair. Those on furlough certainly where I work had nearly 10 weeks off. During that 10 weeks they still accrued holiday , which when they came back guess what most of them then started taking.

After furlough finished the first time we were exceptionally busy and needed staff to be at full capacity but those returning from furlough and then coming back to work then want holiday time during the summer holidays. This meant that although I was by now desperate for some down time I couldn't take any time off. I am burnt out, I am knackered. Now you tell me that is fair

RE: Furlough scheme

rcookieuk — Fri, 08 Jan 2021 20:37:47 GMT

And we wonder why nurses dont stay in this profession!

The current situation is very far removed from school holidays which parents are able to plan childcare for from a variety of family/friends/clubs all of which aren’t available to us at the moment!

Im also more than happy to offer my help at other times when able to and I was well aware of how busy my colleagues were during the first lockdown.

Having staff leave would be counter intuitive though, if furloughing enables staff to be retained then it should be used.

RE: Furlough scheme

Claire D — Fri, 08 Jan 2021 12:39:50 GMT

Apache - I assume you think the staff not being offered furlough will be able to magic up childcare then?? No - it just means they will be forced to use their annual leave (which then means there’s no more paid leave for the rest of the year/school holidays) or they take unpaid leave. They still won’t be in practice, they will just be without any income at all. In response to what we do during school holidays - we carefully manage this with annual leave and holiday clubs (not available right now!) and family/friends a that we can’t see right now.
As has already been said, the government has allowed and advised the furlough scheme to be used for working parents during the lockdown - employers have been advised to ‘do the right thing’. Unfortunately, two large corporates are not doing that at all.

Very disappointing attitude.

RE: Furlough scheme

Ben Ogden — Fri, 08 Jan 2021 09:18:52 GMT

The Furlough scheme has been reworked for more than just businesses forced to close.

Childcare is a big deal for a huge part of our workforce and the 'It's also not fair to the rest of the team still working' way of thinking belongs in the bin. It took me, a non child bearing, white male a while to get around that way of thinking.

If you've got employees with childcare problems as a result of this global nonsense, the best way you can look after your employees and your business's stability is to talk to them and find compromise with shift patterns etc.

As for 'Easter/summer holidays etc?', its an annual nightmare of splitting annual leave between parents, putting on grand parents, having "care share" with freinds all the things you cannot feeably do in this climate, it's not the same.

RE: Furlough scheme

Lucy-lu — Fri, 08 Jan 2021 07:46:41 GMT

I would like to say thank goodness I have a much more supportive practice, as they are currently investigating a way of placing me on furlough. My team rock!

I am sure I am not on my own in the veterinary world with childcare issues. Part of the government scheme is to assist businesses with payment of wages, due to school closure. I have been in the business for 20 years, so have been nursing many years B.C (before children).

Routinely during summer hols/easter/half terms I use my leave/hubby's leave, plus school clubs (which are not available at the moment). I have happily said I will take holiday over this period. Amazingly we don't earn enough to pay for private childcare, or claim anything either.

I cover extra shifts, during school hours, for other staff holidays/before school closures. It's a bit of give and take in this industry, which we do as a team in our practice.

Personally I do think it should be available to the veterinary world. We are bad enough for undervaluing ourselves, so why shouldn't we be treated the same as other industries. Never have we experienced a pandemic. It's troubling times. CIrcumstances are complicated and difficult for us all, in different ways.

Stay safe everyone

RE: Furlough scheme

apache — Thu, 07 Jan 2021 21:54:33 GMT

Whilst I am very sympathetic with the OP, work has been manic throughout COVID and it would be an absolute disaster if I was putting staff of work for many weeks. It's also not fair to the rest of the team still working.

I guess I'd throw back - what do you do during the Easter/summer holidays etc?

Personally I don't think the scheme should be available to vets - it was designed for businesses forced to close and help with the wage bill.

RE: Furlough scheme

Ben Ogden — Thu, 07 Jan 2021 11:19:02 GMT

I work with someone whos husband is fairly high up in H&S and has had quite a bit of dealings with the Furlough scheme. This person I work with asked to take Furlough and was declined, she then came back with the info stating that they cannot refuse her furlough and they granted it.

This was on the previous scheme and it has changed its name and goalposts now.