Pentoject

Re: Pentoject

Nick Shackleton — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 09:45:05 GMT

[quote user="Caro Laithwaite"]

Ditto l mean l know of one to unless it is the same case as you 2.

[/quote]

It may be a case of 6 degrees of seperation!!!!

Re: Pentoject

Caro Laithwaite VN — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 06:37:38 GMT

Ditto l mean l know of one to unless it is the same case as you 2.

Re: Pentoject

Nick Shackleton — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 06:08:25 GMT

[quote user="jewel1973"]

[quote user="Nick Shackleton"]

Can't remember who do them but you can get wee labels with different things already typed onto them. for example we have:

ACP/TORBUGESIC, METHADONE, VETERGESIC, DOMITOR/TORBUGESIC, PROPOFOL, NSAID, ANTIBIOTIC. The company will customize them for you also. Will find out where we get them from.

If things aint labeled I bin them! Thats my rules!!!!!

[/quote]

you get the labels form henley medical or jak marketing (infusion concepts).

i print my own on mini avery labels, and try to colour them accordingly e.g propofol is yellow, and morphine is blue.

totally agree, never assume you know what is in the syring, i know of a case o mistaken identity involving propfol, and betamox (both white) the cat in question died after having 2 mls of betamox i/v.

its not worth the risk.

[/quote]

Thats it couldnt remember last night! Its more common than you think! I know of a simular case

Re: Pentoject

Juliet Drummond DAVN (med) RVN D32/33 — Tue, 16 Jun 2009 23:45:39 GMT

[quote user="Nick Shackleton"]

Can't remember who do them but you can get wee labels with different things already typed onto them. for example we have:

ACP/TORBUGESIC, METHADONE, VETERGESIC, DOMITOR/TORBUGESIC, PROPOFOL, NSAID, ANTIBIOTIC. The company will customize them for you also. Will find out where we get them from.

If things aint labeled I bin them! Thats my rules!!!!!

[/quote]

you get the labels form henley medical or jak marketing (infusion concepts).

i print my own on mini avery labels, and try to colour them accordingly e.g propofol is yellow, and morphine is blue.

its not worth the risk.

Re: Pentoject

Nick Shackleton — Tue, 16 Jun 2009 22:38:02 GMT

Can't remember who do them but you can get wee labels with different things already typed onto them. for example we have:

ACP/TORBUGESIC, METHADONE, VETERGESIC, DOMITOR/TORBUGESIC, PROPOFOL, NSAID, ANTIBIOTIC. The company will customize them for you also. Will find out where we get them from.

If things aint labeled I bin them! Thats my rules!!!!!

Re: Pentoject

S-J — Tue, 16 Jun 2009 22:34:04 GMT

the colour isnt a prob i was just wondering

Re: Pentoject

Kim Buckley — Tue, 16 Jun 2009 18:53:57 GMT

Of course I would throw it. This is why I don't know how the colour can be a problem because surely you always draw drugs up straight from the bottle anyway :)

Re: Pentoject

Nik — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 23:27:43 GMT

This is kind of related but not. we were, however discussing it at work last week.

We were ranting over the nightmare that is batch number control and got to discussing Euthatal and its expiry date.

Please could someone enlighten me

What happens to Euthatal etc when it goes beyond its expiry date? Does it become less effective etc? I'm sure you know what I mean.

Re: Pentoject

Caro Laithwaite VN — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 22:20:41 GMT

Have used pent. as a last ditch for fitting in place of sagital which was 60% dilute strength and in fact was pent. Sagital was withdrawn as it wasn't sterile from what l understand.

We ran out of about 10+ bottles of glucose all the No18 drips and nothing touched them propofol was like giving mayonnaise bloody useless at no point did the 2 dogs glu raise above 3 what a truly s**ty night that was. Pent. took them down for about an hour then it was back again to the merry giggle so we used that till o finally relented and ended up the pair of the dogs boxers being pts. Owner was diabetic and swore blind the dogs never got his insulin but we didn't belive him....

Re: Pentoject

Juliet Drummond DAVN (med) RVN D32/33 — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 22:19:36 GMT

there is no need to used pentobarbitone for status cases nowadays, far safer to use propofol.

totally agree- unlabelled syringes should be chucked, if in doubt- chuck it out

Re: Pentoject

Shona — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 21:56:11 GMT

[quote user="Kimbo1985"]

We have the yellow pentoject. Surely it doesn't matter what colour it it coz don't you only draw it up when you need it??? And if there was a 10ml syringe of it lying around I would assume that it is pentoject and not metacam or acp! lol

[/quote]

I hope you wouldn't 'assume' anything if a 10ml syringe of something was lying around!! Any unlabeled syringes should be chucked!! No question!

Re: Pentoject

Saskia Quinn — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 21:49:18 GMT

pentoject/pentobarbitone/euthatal etc is not a sterile drug. No reason for it to be sterile considering what it is for.

However, if it is used for fitting dogs, anti-biotics are given to the patient as well to counteract the 'non-sterility'

Re: Pentoject

Fiona Leathers — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 18:15:07 GMT

I always had a wonder about using sterile or non-sterile stuff for euthanasia and the answer I got was to make it look better for the client rather for sterility, which obviously isn't an issue in a dead dog / cat / rabbit / a.n.other (delete as appropriate)

Re: Pentoject

Anonymous — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 18:09:16 GMT

[quote user="sal the 1st"]

sterility - why is this an issue? has anybody seen what 'lives' in a 500ml bottle of pentaject when a few doses have been withdrawn? I dont recall ever seeing instructions on the bottle about observing sterile procedure

we used to use food colouring in ours - blue for choice - when I was making batches of the stuff - used to come as a powder and diluent (no not ordinary thio in our case - but have seen places where 10% thio was used instead)

I have seen pentoject used to treat status in dogs - last resort stuff so yes I guess in this instance sterility is an issue - but then the question, should it be used for something it was never intended for ?

[/quote]

dunno this is why i asked! i just got the impression with all of sterile packages of needles and syringes, cleaning, shaving and special bottles there might have been some issue with things needing to be sterile before entering the body? But this was just a guess hence my askin! :D

Re: Pentoject

Gillian Mostyn — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 17:56:28 GMT

[quote user="StephB"]surely that would compromise it's sterile content? I doubt food colouring is 'medical grade' and sterile! [/quote]

As has already been said, septicaemia wasn't a worry after the procedure!

We kept saggital and phenobarb vials for seizuring - pentobarb no more useful if these didn't work.

Re: Pentoject

Cat Woman — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 17:36:50 GMT

[quote user="StephB"]

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]

My previous practice used a yellow brand but put a tiny bit of blue food colouring in the bottle when it arrived - made it unique and I never saw any problems using it at all.

[/quote]

surely that would compromise it's sterile content? I doubt food colouring is 'medical grade' and sterile!

[/quote]

Presumably if someone were going to use it for something else (?seizure control?) then they would use a new bottle. At least, you would hope so!

Re: Pentoject

Sal the 1st — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 17:26:56 GMT

Re: Pentoject

Anonymous — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 16:56:48 GMT

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]

My previous practice used a yellow brand but put a tiny bit of blue food colouring in the bottle when it arrived - made it unique and I never saw any problems using it at all.

[/quote]

surely that would compromise it's sterile content? I doubt food colouring is 'medical grade' and sterile!

Re: Pentoject

Gillian Mostyn — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 16:48:24 GMT

I think it was more to do with the fact that we were using thio back then and they were the same colour (or, rather, colourless) and similar quantities can be drawn up. I doubt there was ever an occasion when 'the blue juice' was likely to be drawn up and left - it just took away any slight vestige of doubt!

Re: Pentoject

Kim Buckley — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 16:13:28 GMT

Re: Pentoject

loobylou — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 16:10:34 GMT

I think Euthatal used to be clear and we used to inject the dark blue diff quick stain into it.
We use pentoject now and cant say we've had any problems with identification so far.

Re: Pentoject

S-J — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 15:32:53 GMT

[quote user="Vicky C"]

We have yellow. Prefer the blue, much more pretty and like you i like the fact it is a diff colour. Good idea with the food dye! I've never seen a prob with it being yellow though, we don't leave syringes of stuff around really to prevent risk of it getting mixed up.

[/quote]

yeah we know its not going to be left on the side, its not the sort of drug that you draw up for later or just in case, and ur not exactly going to mistake the bottle for something else, but its still making us twitchy

Re: Pentoject

Maisy — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 15:07:02 GMT

Using the food dye is a good idea, I can't remember which brand it was but on kind of pentobarb was clear! Food dye came in handy then as not really the drug for mix ups...

Re: Pentoject

Kathryn Welsh — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 15:06:44 GMT

We've just the yellow and all very twitchy over it, but Vicky's right we don't leave syringes lying around so shouldn't be a problem. Except we can no longer use the term 'blue juice'!!

Re: Pentoject

Vicky RVN — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 14:49:32 GMT