WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

Sal the 1st — Sun, 15 Mar 2015 20:09:50 GMT

I am the same Catherine - love the job (most of the time) but for some years now I have been building up an 'alternative' , latterly I have been 'lucky' in that I don't have a mortgage or rent to find - but other bills still need to be paid . Unlike some others I do think that I am well recompensed for the work I do in relation to other occupations. Sure sometimes I feel that I am worth more but then comparing it to some of the other jobs and wages available...I knew when I came into this job that the wages were never going to provide a champagne lifestyle, I accepted the job(s) knowing what the wage was going to be and I knew that it was never going to be that much better even when I qualified so that is why I don't grumble about wage. It doesn't mean things aren't a bit tight sometimes,but I cut my cloth to suit, It's my choice to carry on doing what I am doing so I accept what comes with it. If my employers are fair with me I am fair with them - and if they aren't I move on.

I do get angry when people try and compare our job with those of the NHS - we don't work for the NHS, our employers don't have the NHS budget and lets face it we don't even do the same job. How many NHS nurses do you know who monitor anaesthetics, take radiographs , carry out minor surgery , or work with multiple different species? (ok I will grant you Friday night /weekends on A+E might qualify for the last example)

In spite of what I hear my experience has been that the majority of employers in this job are fair and will pay what they can afford - I know that there are some real tight a**es out there, I am not saying that they don't exist - but these are in the minority because the smart ones have now realised that its better in the long run to retain staff than go through the expense and uncertainty of constantly having to recruit more.

Wishing you well with your new venture

As to the 'too experienced' bit - have come across this a few times - it translates as either can't afford you or apprehension (especially if the practice employs a lot of new grad vets

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

Catherine Allen — Sun, 15 Mar 2015 18:38:10 GMT

This is a really interesting thread. I have been qualified for four and half years. I always knew it didn't pay well and was a career I always wanted to do so don't regret doing it, I've loved the experiences I've had and the people I have met but now I have a mortgage, bills etc I am tired of always having to count the pennies, struggle at the end of each month and worrying about the future. I have thought long and hard and my nursing wage just isn't enough any more. I have started a home based business to earn an extra bit of money each month which I have achieved but I am now going to build this business as it will give more income and a better lifestyle. I think a lot of VNs reach a point in their lives when the income just isn't enough for the hours and work they put in. (I am helping other VNs set up their own businesses) I know not every VN will feel this way though. Please feel free to have a look/follow my FB page and contact me if you want to know more.

https://www.facebook.com/catherinesforeverlifestyle

Good luck to everyone with your journeys

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

bonjovitrace — Sun, 08 Mar 2015 19:24:53 GMT

I'm an RVN and have been looking for work. I have found with 15 years experience I'm being told I'm "over qualified" for positions. You don't know how many jobs I've applied for where I don't even get a reply of any sort or the job description suddenly changes at the interview. I have decided to stay in my current employment as from the interviews I have been to, the grass isn't greener on the other side.

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

elazig elazig — Fri, 20 Feb 2015 09:17:50 GMT

difficult

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

Mark Hedberg — Fri, 20 Feb 2015 08:48:55 GMT

[quote user="S B"]

No one had applied.

Took out a very expensive advert ,no one applied.

Posted here,had lots or clicks but again no one applied.we are in edinburgh so a good place to be and i an told the salary is good???

[/quote]

That's interesting - can you post a copy of the ad here, as well as where you're located? (Just genuinely curious, would be interesting to see the ad copy.)

(In a past life I worked in HR before i went to vet school.)

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

Ems — Thu, 19 Feb 2015 20:13:41 GMT

Hi Seema, I think I know your vets (I'm also in Edinburgh). I thought about applying for some of your vacancies but a lot of people steered me away for reasons I won't put up on here.

Unfortunately the veterinary world is a small one and word gets round quickly. The things I've heard may not be true or they may be exaggerated and that's the worst part, but I really hope you get someone soon!

But to get back to the post, unfortunately for me it's the lack of pay and long hours, which on a bad day make me question why I'm doing this. I've luckily found my happy place where I'm working now, but it took hopping around 3 times before I got it! For now I'm still loving being an RVN

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

FINNIGAN — Thu, 19 Feb 2015 18:38:07 GMT

Both,, seleena! A thanku now an again instead of a grunt,, a bit of praise when I've got a 40% discount on a drug order. And some guidance as to what's expected of me and just a little backup an support on certain issues that arise with staff instead of saying,, ' well that's ure job'!!!

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

SmegSlayer — Thu, 19 Feb 2015 18:26:29 GMT

I'm an RVN and can't find a job!!

I'm in Cambridge, now in the final semester of a full time degree so can only do a max of 16 hours/week plus weekend rota. I have my own car so can travel and there are practices within travelling distance advertising. However, if you can't do 40hrs/week they don't want to know.

The only work I get is with a local group covering a couple of practices in the area for holidays and sickness.

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

S B — Thu, 19 Feb 2015 15:02:28 GMT

It would be really good for practice owners to know exactly what you mean by back up and suppourt??

Also do you want to be rewarded with monetry feedback or just a verbal thank you?

Thanks for answering

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

FINNIGAN — Thu, 19 Feb 2015 13:22:30 GMT

I'm a head nurse,, I earn £23000 I'm happy with my wage,, but get no back up and no support mainly grief and no thanks for what I do,, so unfortunately I'm now looking elsewhere or to give up!!!

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

S B — Thu, 19 Feb 2015 09:21:22 GMT

No one had applied.

Took out a very expensive advert ,no one applied.

Posted here,had lots or clicks but again no one applied.we are in edinburgh so a good place to be and i an told the salary is good???

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

Mark Hedberg — Thu, 19 Feb 2015 09:14:31 GMT

On the surface it's a simple question - on the other hand, what exactly are you looking for in a head nurse? There's not really any two positions alike; are you short on applicants, or can't find a good one?

Cheers,
Mark

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

S B — Thu, 19 Feb 2015 09:12:31 GMT

Why is it so difficult to get a head nurse......salary of 23000.

Is that not a good salary or do people not want the responsibility????

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

steven docherty RVN DipHECVN DipAVN (Small Animal) C-SQP — Fri, 16 Jan 2015 22:44:05 GMT

I agree that the nhs does have a huge budget, we all pay our taxes for it. I am saying that our qualification should be comparable to a nurse that works in the NHS. Of course working in a veterinary practice you can say it is not a multI billion pound business, but let's be honest its not short of a few bob. I am sure many of us would agree that we would like a wage that represents our skills.

Getting back to the original thread, many nurses are leaving because of the lack of respect and poor pay.

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

Natalie Hubbard — Fri, 16 Jan 2015 22:29:01 GMT

hey contact goddards i am with them and they are always taking students for placement

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

Sal the 1st — Fri, 16 Jan 2015 22:01:51 GMT

[quote user="steven docherty RVN DipHECVN DipAVN (Small Animal)"]

The profession we are in is one of the worst for pay. My mother who is an auxiliary nurse in the NHS gets paid more than I do, does less hours and has 8 paid weeks off a year.

[/quote]

And the difference is she works for an organisation with a multi billion budget. Only if you work for an organisation with a comparable budget and comparable number of staff would this be a fair comparison . The NHS is losing money hand over fist and because of this is shedding staff, so maybe their business model isnt that fantastic?

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

Kate Lander — Fri, 16 Jan 2015 21:09:18 GMT

Hi Mark,

I know :-). I did the Clinical Coach training. The process is different, being largely online, but still just as painful.

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

FINNIGAN — Tue, 13 Jan 2015 20:30:50 GMT

I'm afraid I hav the opposite problem,, I earn a very good wage as newly promoted head nurse,, but hav unfortunately lost my faith in my job ,, I can't afford to find something else or to move on as can't find anything else that pays me as well !!

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

Alison Clare Hickman — Wed, 07 Jan 2015 11:03:59 GMT

Hi Mark,

How is being a CC different please?

Thanks

Ali h

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

Mark Hedberg — Wed, 07 Jan 2015 10:25:04 GMT

Kate: Good news, VN training is no longer an NVQ and so no longer involves portfolios, being a clinical coach is different from being an assessor!

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

Kate Lander — Tue, 06 Jan 2015 20:13:17 GMT

Hi Jamie-Lee, I don't know you and haven't seen your CV, but I know what it takes to get accepted by a training practice. Have you written to every practice within 50 miles or so, with a covering letter and CV. Has your CV been checked by someone in the industry? I've seen some dreadful ones which have just gone in the bin. Have you done work experience at every practice that will have you, and/or offered your services as kennel maid for free in your spare time? Have you done work experience in related areas e.g. dog grooming, riding stables, lambing- this all helps. Charity work e.g. RDA, The Blue Cross is also a very good idea. You might have to work for free in your days off for a year or so to prove yourself before a practice will consider training you. Fair? Probably not, but this is the state of play. Bear in mind that degree-qualified nurses earn a grand less per year on average due to being seen as less practically experienced by vets. You'll also be lucky to ever earn enough as a RVN to live independantly, let alone to pay your loans off.

It's also fair to say here that I love training nurses; I've taught loads over the years from the point where they came in to meet us shaking in their boots, through to getting their greens. I didn't have any choice quite often, as the only qualified amongst cheap trainees- if I didn't teach 'em, then I had to do everything myself. But it is very rewarding to watch them learning anaesthetics, taking blood, putting catheters in etc and gaining in confidence. Probably the most rewarding aspect of my career.

Now the confession...training nurses I love, being an assessor/clinical coach? I've actually left jobs to avoid it. As a system, it sucks. I've never felt so patronised as I did as a student myself, and during clinical coach training. The three colleges I've encountered were all so appallingly organised that I felt towards the end of my training, that fifteen minutes with my books revising would be more productive than a frustrating day of college teaching. I hated my portfolios so badly that I couldn't decide whether to ritually burn them or throw them in the local pond. (In the end, they got left with an ex I despised almost as much.) I'm reminded just how much I wanted to be a nurse and how desperately hard I worked to qualify.

It seems to me, reading this thread and reflecting on it all, that it all comes down to salary. Money is what makes the world go round. Let's not be shy about expecting to be paid for doing our job! I would have coached students had I been paid enough, given enough time in my week and been appreciated for it. I don't think I'm greedy, I just want a proper grown-up job where I'm paid like an adult. I will say that the Companion Care and Vets4Pets practices that I've encountered tend to pay their staff better than most, though they work long hours and lots of weekends. Nursing was my second career and I left a good job, fully aware of the wages etc, to pursue it. It's been quite satisfying, but I've never had any spare money and worked my *** off, so at 37, I'm quite happy to have babies and leave it behind :-)

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

Jamie-Lee Wilson — Sun, 04 Jan 2015 12:32:52 GMT

I have read everyone's thoughts and strains on this feed, I would give my right arm and leg just to get my foot in the door and work in a Veterinary Practice to gain experience and study to become a RVN, I have been wanting to do this for the last 2 years, and for some reason no practice is interested.

I spoke with a student Veterinary Nurse and she informed me trying to study at college on day release and work in a practise is one of the hardest ways to become a RVN, and she had to go to University.

Like many of you have said, the money aspect of it does come into play and unfortunately I don't want to put myself in thousands of pounds worth of debt, I just want to do a job that I know will be challenging at times but with animals I deeply care for!

If any of you have any advice that i could use, it would be most appreciated as I am starting to loose faith and I am not getting any younger!

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

myrkk — Wed, 31 Dec 2014 19:00:40 GMT

I am currently about to do some locum work for the practice I have just left as they have been unable to find an RVN to replace me. My nursing career started in 1989 and I left practice earning £13k for a 3 day week which I thought wasn't bad. My last full time position paid me £18,500/yr for a 40hr week plus a 1 night/wk on call and 1:4 weekend.

Part of the problem is people don't seem to want to do out of hours any more and tbh we get paid peanuts for the hours/responsibility we have. I remember when I first started my training Human nurses were striking for better pay as they were in our very position, unfortunately, given we work in private practice not the NHS I don't see this as a viable option for us. The situation is not helped by comments in industry magazines saying the way to keep your nurses on side is to ensure a plentiful supply of tea, biscuits and chocolate. Actually the way to retain nurses is to allow them to do their jobs without undermining them, pay them a living wage and give them the same respect you expect as a Veterinary Professional.

As a youngster I was idealistic and naïve as an adult I am retraining to start my own business.

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

Sal the 1st — Wed, 31 Dec 2014 12:53:40 GMT

on the flip side I dont think many nurses understand exactly what the vets job involves - a lot goes on in the background that isn't obvious ie paying the bills, making sure staff are paid, making sure the building/equipment is in good repair etc on top of being a vet. Not having a dig because I think there is so much of both jobs that aren't fully understood/ appreciated by the other side.

Unqualified is not always the cheaper option when it comes to paying the wages - and I know this from experience. I have worked for corporates more than once where receptionists are paid more than their qualified nurses. Its not always a case of nurses being paid the minimum management can get away with sometimes its the maximum the practice can afford and sometimes I think people have to be a bit more realistic in what they can expect to earn in this job, especially in the smaller stand alone practices.

I totally agree with you that it can be a lack of awareness rather than a lack of care but I think to some extent we are all guilty of that

RE: WHERE HAVE ALL THE QUALIFIED NURSES GONE?????

SuzyM — Wed, 31 Dec 2014 12:29:52 GMT

In my experience, vets rarely understand what our job involves. They see the surface of what we do but not the other 80% (!). They are good at what they do as vets but do not always understand what skills a nurse requires to do a good job which is why many don't appreciate qualified status. Because they don't see a lot of the things we do they have no idea whether they are being done competently (e.g. biosecurity, lab work). Good practices will check up on these things, but otherwise it's down to the integrity of the individual they have employed (qualified or not). I believe this is why many will always go for the cheaper option when recruiting. It's not that they don't care, rather that they are unaware.