Nutrition advice please

RE: Nutrition advice please

suz85 — Sun, 30 Nov 2014 11:08:04 GMT

No experience of using it in dogs, but I feed my very greedy cat on Royal Canins Satiety diet and it is honestly the best thing ever! He would constantly be looking for more food, jumping onto counters, miaowing constantly, scratching at doors and he was getting pretty fat as my husband would give in and feed him. Since putting him on that, he has lost 1kg (over a year) and is now a BCS 5, but best of all, doesnt beg, he seems to be content after eating, I recommend it to everyone now :)

RE: Nutrition advice please

nickyc — Tue, 18 Nov 2014 18:18:51 GMT

Really not looking for a debate either, but I would never rule out any training method beside the obvious ie: harsh training techniques that cause any pain or suffering. All dogs are different, and different techniques work differently for every dog, but sometimes a combination of both can be most effective. Some negative reinforcement as part of a behaviour modification programme is totally acceptable. The problems you have listed sound behaviour related and whilst what your are doing with him are excellant a behaviour consult is really worth its wait in gold, and will be a real eye opener. He really should have nailed both his recall and leave it command by now, so if he hasnt sometimes you do have to think outside the box, and try something else which might be more effective. He's recall training is being affected by the scavenging, so if you address the scavenging the recall will most likely come right. If he is already postively rewarding himself by eating when scavenging how is he supposed to learn that scavenging is just not allowed, when the training is followed up with more postive inforcement? Its no different when you were a kid you got sent to your room for misbehaving your parents used a negative reinforcement. It never did any harm, but you understood the consequence of your actions, which motivated you not to do it again, had they rewarded you with sweets. It would have encouraged you to do it again. I really would consider a behaviour consult. There are loads of training techniques, and the correct behaviourist would be able to assess your dog and offer a programme which maybe more effective at helping you solve the issue. The longer it continues the less likely you are to ever stop it. For me personnelly using a spray collar for 6 months on my highly food motivated dog just to interuupt the scavenging long enough to reinforce his leave it command followed by a postive reinforcement worked wonders. He will still occasionally scavenge at the park but when asked to leave it will spit out what ever he's got even when at a distance, and head back to me for a treat! For me using the spray collar for 6 months of his life was worth the slight discomfort he experienced, and we have now enjoyed 7 years of stress free walks rather then the scavenging continue and risk an exlap for a foreign body removal. If your really not keen on the spray collar then a behaviourist will have loads of other methods of training up their sleeves, and really will make life better for you both of you...:-)

RE: Nutrition advice please

Steph Worsley — Mon, 17 Nov 2014 20:03:04 GMT

this may sound a bit odd....but have you screened him for conditions that may cause polyphagia? Diabetes for example? I know he's young BUT you can never rule these things out!

RE: Nutrition advice please

bongo — Mon, 17 Nov 2014 18:53:58 GMT

Never heard of this, will do some research, thanks for the suggestion

RE: Nutrition advice please

Heather Bacon — Mon, 17 Nov 2014 15:04:58 GMT

As you are on Hills already would Hills Metabolic be any good?

I don't know a huge amount about it, but we have a few clients (and vets dog!) who are on it, they are all now a nice trim size and owners have reported less begging for food, scavenging etc.

RE: Nutrition advice please

bongo — Mon, 17 Nov 2014 13:44:04 GMT

Thanks for both of your replies, its frustrating because his mental stimulation is fine, he goes to training twice a week and I am home with him during the day and as I said he gets a stuffed kong in the afternoon, I will try freezing the wet biscuits though.

Any slow feeders he just chews up, have tried a pyramid and a green, both get wrecked and I can't afford to keep replacing them!

Exercise wise he gets 2 sometimes 3 walks a day weather permitting each for between 30 mins to an hr, on a weekend always gets a good hr of off lead walking.

Really good suggestions in both replies, prob won't do the spray idea though as I only believe in training via positive reinforcement, not looking for a debate here, its just the way I have trained since a pup!

Re: Nutrition advice please

nickyc — Tue, 11 Nov 2014 15:40:25 GMT

Personnelly I would look more into his mental stimulation.. Some dogs learn that they get attention from eating and so constantly ask for food also lots of happy hormones get released from eating so he could be a bit of an junky.. I would personnely try a different food which might suit him better, and look into the feeding volumes, as some dogs like one of mine own will eat 100g of food at a time, so I have to feed her a concentrated food so she gets what she needs without eating a large volume where you need the opposite, so look into a diet that has a large volume of food, and as someone else mentioned feed 3 even 4 meals a day with the volume divided up. Personnely I would be careful of high protein diets and think the recommended amounts off the top of my head is no more then 30%. Also feed a portion of wet food as this will keep him fuller for longer. I would also drag out meal times there are loads of interactive toys on the market I would buy several and rotate them to keep him interested.. Also try soaking his kibble in hot water until its mushy then stuff it in a kong then freeze it. Also scattter and hide his food again to keep him busy, and drag out meal times. Dont always feed him when he asks for food, but divert his attention and maybe do a five minute clicker training session or game of fetch etc. Also make sure he is getting plently of exercise as generally a tired dog sleeps after a walk, and forgets about his belly. Recall I would get in touch with a behaviorist, and consider the use of a remote spray collar for scavenging its important you get the timing right, but it will help to reinforce the leave it command, and prevent the scavenging.. Also make sure you keep his walks entertaining so his mind isnt always fixed on things to eat, but concentrating on you because your fun, and he doesnt know what your going to do. Again a behavourist will help but clicker training, fetch, scenting and hide and seek games will keep him occupied on walks.. Lastly also change his food bowl to a brakefast or maze type bowl to slow his eating down...

Re: Nutrition advice please

funkyfish — Tue, 11 Nov 2014 10:12:54 GMT

What is his weight like? Is he a bit under muscled? A high protein diet will make him feel more full, if his weight is good just up the protein and not the fat.

My dogs are on CSJ Rocket fuel as they need high protien and fat or they loose weight and muscle. Its almost 30% prot and 28% fat- i add more fat (oil) to my collies food for energy. CSJ do a good range of well priced food with a range of protein and fat levels.

Could try a puzzle feeder or feed all meals in a kong/scatter feed etc. 3-5 meals a day instead?