A Difficult Situation

Re: A Difficult Situation

Sal the 1st — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 13:04:57 GMT

instead of seeing this as being to the detriment of your training could you see it another way? Could you see it that this vet is actually helping you to gain an excellent training ( in people skills) because you are having to work out how to resolve this situation, and people skills I would say are of paramount importance in this job and not the easiest of things to work with.

PM me if you think I can help

Re: A Difficult Situation

Stephanie Barnard-Horne RVN CertFN MBVNA — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 13:04:02 GMT

[quote user="Sal the 1st"]

ok - by the sound of it you both need to feel 'needed'. So what needs to happen so you can both support each each other?

Could you start it off next time by instead of asking if you can do something asking what they would like you to do? - you might be surprised

[/quote]

I'll give it a go. Thank you. :)

Re: A Difficult Situation

Sal the 1st — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 12:57:47 GMT

ok - by the sound of it you both need to feel 'needed'. So what needs to happen so you can both support each each other?

Could you start it off next time by instead of asking if you can do something asking what they would like you to do? - you might be surprised

Re: A Difficult Situation

Stephanie Barnard-Horne RVN CertFN MBVNA — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 12:56:11 GMT

[quote user="Sal the 1st"]

Do you know for certain that they are doubting your skills and training? - or is this just the way it seems to you? How do you know they dont trust anybody who isnt a vet? Sometimes things arent at all how they seem.

Here is another possibility to consider - could it be that when you are asking to place catheters etc the vet might be feeling that you are asking to do this because it is you that is doubting their skills and training ( I have seen this happen quite a few times before). Without intending it by asking if you can do things you might be really knocking their confidence in their ability.

Could it be that they are 'avoiding' staff meetings because they are in reality holding the fort (taking the phones etc)while everybody else has their meeting? or that they are feeling uncomfortable and dont feel part of the team? Is there a chance that they avoid sitting down and talking face to face because they dont feel comfortable in that situation - they may find it intimidating if you are a strong (or a stronger) personality? or is it a case that they are genuinely busy and wanting to concentrate on what they are doing?

How much of what you are asking to do is stuff that 'must ' be done for your NPL and how much of it is stuff you would 'like' to do for your NPL?

Its a difficult one because I can see how you want to do the practical stuff to pass an exam but I can also see how somebody starting out is needing to develop their level of confidence as well.

I think the overall single most important thing to remember is that nurses are there to assist a vet, dont forget until you are qualified that the vet or RVN who is supervising you is responsible for anything that might go wrong when you are doing something.

[/quote]I really appreciate your reply. It is helping me to see things in a different light.

But if they do feel uncomfortable, would prefer not to sit down and talk to me and that I may make them feel I doubt their skills. There seems to be no easy way to resolve this.Our practice manager requested that they talk to me but they never did.

Our personalities do clash and that makes things very difficult. I'm quiet and keep to myself but I feel often that makes it worse because things go unsaid for such a long period of time.

I think for me it is less about the experience and more about our working relationship. It is so hard to work with a vet on ops if they make me feel like they don't trust me. In that situation I think it is vial that both can communicate well and that their roles are clearly defined.

I guess an email to all involved requesting a meeting to discuss this? I don't want to make them feel uncomfortable but this situation has caused me so much stress I cannot face it anymore.

Re: A Difficult Situation

Stephanie Barnard-Horne RVN CertFN MBVNA — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 12:29:22 GMT

Thank you for all of the replies!

Its very helpful to have so many different perspectives and gives me a lot to think about.

In answer to a lot of the questions regarding what I should and shouldn't be doing. I am only under taking skills that I have been given in depth training in, followed by weeks of demonstrations and finally supervised practice by both a qualified RVN and a VS. I would never undertake something I had not been fully trained to do. I'm actually a bit obsessive about this and will always say when I know I don't have enough training or knowledge on the case that way I can improve my understanding for the next time. I always aim to be over prepared.

I know the vet needs to gain experience too. I just wish I didn't feel so strongly that it is at the detriment of my training. It is more than catheters. I realize a lot of nurses don't routinely place catheters but this vet will literally try to do everything from start to finish of each op. All the way from TPR to extubating. ..even clipping and scrubbing when they need to be scrubbing. It makes me feel irrelevant.

I am working so hard and spending countless hours studying to be great at what I do and when I get treated like I don't even need to be there then it completely knocks my confidence and takes all the joy out of my job.

I guess the main advice I need is how do you resolve conflict between other colleagues at work? Because I have tried bring this up with them and they don't seem to want to talk about it with me.

Thanks again for the input! Especially on a Sunday.

I am very grateful!

Steph

Re: A Difficult Situation

Julie-Anne Wilson — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 11:32:10 GMT

[quote user="Stuart McQueen RVN MBVNA"]

[quote user="Julie-Anne Harrison"]

My first thought on reading this was, should you be placing catheters? I thought it was only qualified nurses that were allowed to place catheters and draw blood etc?

[/quote]

This going to sound cheeky, but it's not ment to, so apology in advance...

How did you learn to place IV catheter? Most the catheters and bloods that are taken at the hospital I work in is done by student nurses (under supervision).. the qualified nurses get to a point where they tell the students that they aren't doing them because we start to feel out of practice with it! It is a requirement for the NPL.

[/quote]

I didn't place any catheters or take blood until I was qualified. I'd watched it being done plenty of times but never did it myself until I passed my exams.

Re: A Difficult Situation

Sal the 1st — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 09:28:58 GMT

[quote user="Stuart McQueen RVN MBVNA"]

Most the catheters and bloods that are taken at the hospital I work in is done by student nurses (under supervision).. the qualified nurses get to a point where they tell the students that they aren't doing them because we start to feel out of practice with it! It is a requirement for the NPL.

[/quote]

any chance this could be how the vet is feeling too? I know its a requirement for the NPL just the same as it was when I sat the exam back in 1996 but the only cannula placements I got were the ones that were 'given' - there was no negotiation between vet and nurse. I still learnt and I still passed an exam. It was only when I moved into a busier hospital situation that I ended up doing a lot of them. I might be wrong but from the original post this could be a recently qualified vet who is also wanting to build their confidence in cannula placement?

Sorry if that isnt what people want to hear - just trying to see it from both sides

Re: A Difficult Situation

Stuart McQueen RVN MBVNA — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 08:24:53 GMT

[quote user="Julie-Anne Harrison"]

My first thought on reading this was, should you be placing catheters? I thought it was only qualified nurses that were allowed to place catheters and draw blood etc?

[/quote]

This going to sound cheeky, but it's not ment to, so apology in advance...

Re: A Difficult Situation

GremlinNurse — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 00:26:31 GMT

SVNs can place catheters and take blood as long as under direct and constant supervision by an RVN or a VS. That was my understanding and is what happens in my practice. It must come under sched. 3 procedures. X

Re: A Difficult Situation

Julie-Anne Wilson — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 00:18:15 GMT

My first thought on reading this was, should you be placing catheters? I thought it was only qualified nurses that were allowed to place catheters and draw blood etc?

Am I wrong in thinking this? And if I'm right, maybe this Vet is thinking the same thing? I know I'd rather place a catheter than have a student do it because, as I said, I thought it was something SVNs weren't allowed to do.

Re: A Difficult Situation

Sal the 1st — Sat, 04 Feb 2012 23:58:47 GMT

How much of what you are asking to do is stuff that 'must ' be done for your NPL and how much of it is stuff you would 'like' to do for your NPL?

Its a difficult one because I can see how you want to do the practical stuff to pass an exam but I can also see how somebody starting out is needing to develop their level of confidence as well.

Re: A Difficult Situation

Paulette — Sat, 04 Feb 2012 23:42:52 GMT

Hello :) Sorry to hear that you are having a tough time getting hands on practice. Have you tried putting your request of a meeting into writing? Perhaps writing a letter to your head nurse will make her take it more seriously and acknowledge that you really would like to talk about this?