Lungworm in Practice.........

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

chris beasley — Mon, 20 Apr 2009 23:17:09 GMT

In our practice we use advocate alone monthly. If this works as a prevention against Lungworm, why do they recommend milbemax as well. As Advocate washes out easily we advise owners with regular swimming dogs to use stronghold and milbimax monthly.

Are we wrong?

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

loobylou — Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:17:39 GMT

If suspicioius of lungworm our vets give a weekly dose of milbemax for 4 consecutive weeks, which I think is what the data sheet recommends.

The vets are due to have a meeting next week to discuss protocol for prevention and treatment.

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Claire Cameron — Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:12:52 GMT

[quote user="NickyVN"]

Yes but not as a single dose, quite misleading the recent advertising that has been about, gives the impression its asingle dose till you read the small print. Would personally choose panacur for treatment as milbemax has to be given over about 5 weeks!! Too easy for owners to forget

[/quote]

Our vets have been giving it to suspected cases for 3 weeks only

Good to know that, Thanks muchly xxx

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Nicola Smith — Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:11:04 GMT

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Anonymous — Mon, 20 Apr 2009 19:10:58 GMT

Just a quick one to let you know that Milbemax is also licensed to treat both Lungworms, including Crenesoma Vulpis.

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

sarahpearce81 — Wed, 04 Mar 2009 21:23:39 GMT

Milbemax (milbemycin) belongs to a group of macrocyclic lactones, as does one of the drugs in Advocate (moxidectin). They haven't done much study in the usage of both drugs together, so as per advice from data sheets, they advise the concurrent use of the two drugs, to be used with caution.

If you look at Noah compendium online, it only tells you on the milbemax page, on the further information tab!

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Mrs Dot Dot — Wed, 04 Mar 2009 20:35:50 GMT

We've had alot of discussion at work today, with talking to reps, different interpretations of data sheets, etc etc so I'm sorry if I confused/ got any obvious facts wrong in original post but it's something that we are trying to work out a practice protocol for, and also trying to work out the best way to advise clients without panicing them but advising what is best all round for them.

After originally being told by one of our vets that Milbemax wasn't licenced properly for lungworm, after she read the data sheet, the rep vet says that it is ok if used once a week for 4 weeks and actually does for 2 types of lungworm but Advocate only does for one (sorry haven't got names etc yet), but the data sheet doesn't quite say this..........

Mibemax can be used with Advocate but only if it is used 1st and then Advocate used at least 4 days later but.................... please don't take my word for this because at the moment my head is too full of lungworm stuff and so I would just advise speaking to all the reps and go from there! We are having a practice meeting about it tomorrow....................

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Fiona Leathers — Wed, 04 Mar 2009 19:07:34 GMT

I tried emailing it today but the computer kept freezing so will try again tomorrow once I get back to work.

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Sandra Taylor RVN, MBVNA — Wed, 04 Mar 2009 14:18:37 GMT

Send me one too Fi.. e mail is zazangaz@btinternet.com

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Saskia Quinn — Wed, 04 Mar 2009 13:38:42 GMT

We had 2 confirmed cases of lungworm in dogs last year. These were confirmed by bronchi-alveolar lavage and sent to lab

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Claire Cameron — Wed, 04 Mar 2009 13:15:41 GMT

Hiya We've had about 10 suspected but not confirmed due to money restrictions

but our vets have been pretty sure.

I treat my pets with Milbemax, I know when I locummed down south they had heaps suspected but again due to money, very few confirmed

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Royalsuper_fairy — Wed, 04 Mar 2009 12:53:06 GMT

We've had a few comfirmed cases and a few surgical cases that have been suspected and having alot of clients phone up and asking us about treating lung worm and heart worm.

We had a case that we sent to the RVC and they treated lungworm with one dose of milbemax weekly for four weeks and on the fifth week re-test the faeces and this seemed to work for the two confirmed cases we've had.

I looked really clever when I told the boss how to treat it, the doses and when to do faecal testing .

Emma x

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Anonymous — Wed, 04 Mar 2009 08:40:07 GMT

Why can't you use Advocate with Milbemax? It's what I have used for my Ocicat for years and i rotate Advocate with Stronghold. Please don't tell me this I just gave them both to my pregnant queen!!!!!!!! Not to mention the practice I worked at up in London recommended Advocate and Milbemax to other clients!!!

As for Lungworm, its been in the US for years and is quite common. Generally found in dogs that like to eat things off the ground... with this warmer weather and wetness I'm afraid it's only going to get worse. Cats are also at risk of them and should be treated too. Mosquitos are the other evil carriers of Heartworm that we will also need to keep an eye out for. As they are becoming more populated here now.

[quote user="Mrs Dot Dot"]

Has anyone had any suspected cases of lungworm in practice?

We have had 3 that we suspect (in the last 4 wks or so).. can't prove it, but all were young (between 2 and 4), previously fit, healthy dogs.... a beagle with sudden collapse, pale, ? chest problems, we referred her and they suspected lungworm but couldn't prove it, Another was a young staffie for routine castration that oozed from it's wound for 3-4 days and the 3rd was a Basset Fauve de Bretagne (I think! just had to look it up!) with similar symptoms to the beagle..... all recovered with a/b cover etc and panacur treatment.

They have coincided with the Bayer promotion campaign, so I think it is worrying. We are just looking at changing our flea and worm treatment recommendations.... at the moment we use Milbemax and Stronghold but are thinking of changing to Advocat (hopefully I've spelt this right) and back to Drontal. Advocat cannot be used with Milbemax but got excited today as one of the vets found some promotional material saying that Milbemax is licenced for lungworm but on reading the (very) small print it isn't unless you use something as well that isn't licenced in this country apparently... abit naughty I think!

Anyway, has anyone come across any cases, or is routinely recommending treating for lungworm in practice? Would be interested to know... It seems to spreading across the country now, and I am definately going to treat my dog, as my garden is a mass of slugs and snails, unfortunately!! The dogs can pick it up from contact with the snail/slug slime as well.

[/quote]

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Leigh Hinsley RVN NCert(BDev) MBVNA — Tue, 03 Mar 2009 22:32:30 GMT

We had the bayer rep come out and do the talk and it was really interesting, we haven't had any confirmed cases but we've had 2 bitch speys and 1 dog castrate who had to come back to the surgery due to post-op bleeding - one had to even be opened up again because it appeared to be poring out of her but no point of the bleed was found, all ligatures intact - just oozing from everywhere really!! And these were cases just since Christmas, but then we could be just suspicious because the symptom has been drawn to our attention? Worth a ponder though!

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Katy — Tue, 03 Mar 2009 22:22:41 GMT

Could you maybe offer cheapish worm counts for clients pets, and then if lungworm is present, sell them some advocate?

Just an idea?

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Katy — Tue, 03 Mar 2009 21:45:32 GMT

Thanks Bouncyfi!

God, it makes you paranoid doesn't it?!

My naughty labradors like water, so they are probably at risk. Spose could always get them wormcounted just to check....

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Fiona Leathers — Tue, 03 Mar 2009 21:40:25 GMT

If you got to the "What's New" section on top tool bar there's a bit in there about lungworm & a new campaign Bayer will be starting.

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

hissycat — Tue, 03 Mar 2009 21:34:19 GMT

I wish we did free flea/worm checks... people always think you're trying to squeeze money out of them even though you're just trying to do your best for the animal. grrr.

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Fiona Leathers — Tue, 03 Mar 2009 21:21:21 GMT

This would be a great article for your local paper & a free advert for your practice!!

Highlight the problem of this "new" worm - how vague but terrible the symptoms are - try to see if there have been any confirmed cases round your way - check out cicada website - then show how easy it is to prevent it!

Get a picture of a cute puppy dying on your consult table, next pic you applying the treatment (how easy!! and then next pic happy bouncy puppy again!! Wee Hee result - loads of people in your practice, buying loads of advocate & huge bonuses to all the great nurses!!!

We saw a huge increase in interest from a story regarding the first case in Scotland so the paper is definately a good idea.

We sell Advocate to clients who we have seen in the last year, if they've not been seen then they pop in for a free worm check with the vet.

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

hissycat — Tue, 03 Mar 2009 21:15:48 GMT

Advocate is POM -V isn't it? most of our clients don't come in that regularly (unfortunately a lot are vaccine phobic) or just come in as unregistered clients looking for a flea treatment, so we usually recommend frontline/drontal. unfortunately there isn't usually a vet on hand to prescribe/dispense in our practice. would you recommend a vet consult in that case ? just for 'at risk' dogs? or do you dispense if client has been seen recently? I worry that clients would panic if you started telling them over the counter they should be treating for lungworm also if they are not aware of the problem....

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Fiona Leathers — Tue, 03 Mar 2009 21:14:47 GMT

Slugs, snails & frogs can all carry lung worm & the larvae are excreted through the snail mucus trail too.

Dogs can pick up the larvae from drinking exposed waters, eating debris with snail trail on it or munching on the aforementioned slimy bas*ards. If you leave water bowls or toys outside you are exposing your dog to this very serious risk.

I suppose that dogs could also pick it up from eating birds which have eaten the slimy blighters too.

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Emma Clark — Tue, 03 Mar 2009 21:11:06 GMT

I'm in Portsmouth in the South, We had one confirmed case at the end of last year and have had 2 suspect cases since but the owners didn't want to carry out a faecal test. All were routine surgery cases where the wounds just kept oozing. We have been using advocate as our main flea/worming control for about 2 years. We give it alongside milbemax but the milbemax has to be given 2 weeks after advocate. For all routine procedures now we are trying to encourage owners to have given at least two months worth of advocate treatment as after one treatment there is still a small chance they may still have lungworms but after 2 treatments it has 100% efficacy.

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Katy — Tue, 03 Mar 2009 20:51:44 GMT

Eek!

What is with all this bad news today!

Lungworm is caught from dogs eating slugs and snails initially, isn't it? How is it then passed on? Through faeces as usual?

Not up to speed on lungworm am I?!

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Fiona Leathers — Tue, 03 Mar 2009 20:50:12 GMT

I'm in the central belt of Scotland & we've had confirmed cases from the vet school

Re: Lungworm in Practice.........

Katy — Tue, 03 Mar 2009 20:49:02 GMT

So Milbemax doesn't get rid of lungworm then? Rubbish.

How far North has lungworm got? Bit scary.

Might be giving my lot Advocate from now on then. Advocate does everything!!!