Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Sal the 1st — Sun, 31 Jul 2011 22:11:48 GMT

I totally respect your opinion as somebody who is geographically and careerwise in a better position than me to comment- I have had to base my decision on 'sides' on what I have read (and there is an awful lot when you sit down and read through everything it took me days)

I do think that these cats have been let down by both individuals and the authorities. I was initially very upset to read of the declawing but then I read further and found that it was advised and carried out by MAF vets so I gathered from that it must have been legal practice at the time it was carried out in the same way it is still legal in the States? (totally different situation I know but maybe a bit like docking tails in this country?)

I have read that a number of the cats are unrehomeable and that euthanasia is a possibility - again I can only go on what I am able to read and cannot tell if that is fact or another work of fiction but I know what happened when the zoo near me closed and animals quietly disappeared when they were 'relocated' to other zoos - only to 'reappear' later on when the site was redeveloped. So for me I would rather they stay where they are and the site is improved so they dont get 'lost' in transit so long as they have a decent QOL

I must admit I have allowed 70,000 people supporting one side and less than a 1,000 supporting the other to sway my judgement a little but my primary concern in all of this is the cats not necessarily the squabbling humans

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Celine — Sun, 31 Jul 2011 21:18:03 GMT

As a New Zealander AND a VN who works in a large zoo, I'm completely bloody ashamed of this whole mess.

I'm sorry to say it Sal, because I quite often agree with you on many things you post on here, and this certainly isn't a go at anyone who has sympathy for this cause!! I respect the fact you've chosen to take notice of a big drama in a little country miles away. I'm afraid in my opinion the NZ authorities are the ones who have failed wholeheartedly. That guy should never have been allowed to own so many big cats without maintaining far higher welfare standards, there should never have been any close-contact work (getting in and wrestling etc) and the vets who do the declawing should be struck off (although I'm not sure if its even illegal in NZ yet).

Sadly this is just symptomatic of a country's attitude towards animal welfare and the owning of animals in general. We have some excellent zoos doing some great work in Kiwiland but dodgy places like this still prosper because sadly there is still a large section of NZ society who are the sort who would throw stones at a lion to wake it up and do something exciting... This, obviously, isn't an exclusive right of new zealanders, but I notice a marked difference in attitudes generally in the UK to those back home. Generally attitudes are about 20 - 30 years behind the UK.

I do, however, agree that something must be done urgently about the situation with the cats. I don't necessarily believe that Busch is the best person to do this - there must be an independent response from a member zoo of a regulated body such as WIAZA (World association of Zoos and Aquaria). In this way the animals will be tracked and checked upon by an external, independent inspector for the rest of their lives, and any matings or animal transfers will be decided by a central committee. I'd absolutely support a fundraising drive to have this happen - don't forget, almost all zoos are charities, so if there is a financial barrier they may not be able to overcome it without help! It rankles me slightly that the way to salvation seems to seen as the reinstation of Busch. That to me is a separate PR drive.

Again, the NZ authorities granted a license to hold this many animals with no contingencies in place for the collapse of what is ultimately a business, without due regard to what might happen in this event.... I'll shake my head in despair and then hang it in shame...

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Sal the 1st — Sun, 31 Jul 2011 20:00:11 GMT

thanks muchly

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Dippy — Sun, 31 Jul 2011 19:50:39 GMT

Thanks Sal - signed!

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Sal the 1st — Sun, 31 Jul 2011 19:32:10 GMT

http://www.gopetition.co.uk/petitions/reinstate-lionman-craig-busch.html

here it is

http://www.injustice.co.nz/ a non fb page which might give you a bit of an update as well

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Sal the 1st — Sun, 31 Jul 2011 19:29:43 GMT

will have a look for you

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Dippy — Sun, 31 Jul 2011 19:22:57 GMT

Sal - Am I being really thick? I can't find a link on the website for the petition. Is that just on his facebook page and if so, can I access it in any other way as i don't "do" facebook? Thanks.

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Sal the 1st — Sun, 31 Jul 2011 19:08:33 GMT

Zion is now in receivership - for those that want to support here is the link to the Craig Busch facebook page (and I dont necessarily mean financial support either - people support by way of signing the petition is just as important) .Hope to see some of you there. There is a link on the left hand side of the page that will fill you in on what has been happening.

Anybody who knows me will tell you it is very very rare for me to openly support anything like this (usually I am very quiet and very private about what I do or do not support), but having carefully considered everything I have read I see this as the best chance for the cats.

Sorry cant post link but it is NZ Lionman - Craig Busch if you put it in search or check out the link i posted a little earlier on the thread

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Caro Laithwaite VN — Wed, 06 Jul 2011 05:42:11 GMT

Never watched the series mainly as l was always doing things when it was on. I will have an in depth look but thanks for that link has the notes on with heck lot links and yup seems you are right a big injustice was done.

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Sal the 1st — Tue, 05 Jul 2011 23:24:47 GMT

http://tvnz.co.nz/national-news/zookeeper-killed-doing-he-loved-2759113

theres a lot of story to catch up on with Zion itself - I could post links all night amnd still not run out of them - its all very sad what has happened.

I am supporting this cause because having read as much as I can find I feel that this is the best chance these cats now have. There has been an awful lot of mudslinging going on and its the cats that are paying for it

http://www.facebook.com/?ref=home#!/pages/NZ-Lionman-Craig-Busch/43253796601

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

hayleyw — Tue, 05 Jul 2011 23:02:53 GMT

Ooh I always liked lion man.. always wondered what happened to the bloke though for the programmes to be dedicated to him. What's the story? What happened?

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

PHA86 — Sat, 02 Jul 2011 00:04:51 GMT

I used to be a Lion Man fan, however in hindsight of my fad, a things were questionable. Having said that, with these rare breed big cats things are not so straight forward, I believe he had the best intentions. The chap who got killed was the African keeper that Craig met (in one of the episodes) when he was obtaining Gandor, the little white lion cub. Man I loved that little cub, and he turned out to be the most amazing, beautiful lion!

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Phrin Vernon RVN — Fri, 01 Jul 2011 23:09:09 GMT

Wow

I have always quite liked watching his show.... though no one will fill the hole Steve Irwin left.... (For all his faults, I liked him a lot!) Crazy Ozzie! I notice the croc hunter is never on anymore :(

What is going on now at Zion? Why did Craig leave?

Maybe I should just google lol!

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Sal the 1st — Fri, 01 Jul 2011 21:19:22 GMT

thats one way of looking at it depending on which bits you read - but there are lots of other ways of looking at it too

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Caro Laithwaite VN — Fri, 01 Jul 2011 20:48:12 GMT

Is this the place in New Zealand where the guy had the claws removed from the lions so he could get more mileage out of tv appearances?

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

Sal the 1st — Fri, 01 Jul 2011 19:37:22 GMT

yes - it was looking up the person who the programmes are in memory of that uncovered a whole lot more going on. Craig Busch is no longer there

Re: Zion Wildlife Gardens - Lion Man series

shelly jefferies — Fri, 01 Jul 2011 12:05:02 GMT

Sorry ignore my ignorance but what is the problem with lion man and zion gardens have seen quite a few episodes of this programme, and thought he seemed quite a talented man. Is the keeper who was killed the man who the programmes are in memory of in the end.