rage syndrome?

Re: rage syndrome?

zalenski81 — Mon, 13 Sep 2010 16:25:11 GMT

[quote user="Fleabee99"]

where would i find a qualified dog behaviouist? when i look on the net i only get "experienced" dog trainer, obviously i need a proper opinion on what his options are

[/quote]

If you email rosiebarclay@uk2.net she may be able to help you. She is based in Jersey but may be able to offer you some advice or be able to point you in the direction of someone qualified in England.

Good luck!

Re: rage syndrome?

funkyfish — Mon, 13 Sep 2010 08:00:54 GMT

I seem to remember that 'rage syndrome' can be a form of epilepsy- ie the brain goes squiffy and the get aggressive over something the wouldn't normally then are fine again - like a switch going off, poss read that some respond to meds- but not sure what.

Don't forget that he could be showing body language to say he's not happy before he explodes but you cant see it? (they have 180 facial expressions, we have 40- our brain is not programmed to see a lot of their subtle body language). Try and film an episode, keep a diary of food, and behaviour, walks encounters, people present, time of day, there may be a pattern that you have not noticed yet. True 'rage syndrome' is very rare.

I second finding an APBC or CCAB behaviourist. www.apbc.org.uk

Re: rage syndrome?

Vicky RVN — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 21:45:37 GMT

Sorry to hear about the problems you're having with your boy. As others have said, def go to a good, experienced behaviourist. I used one who was trained by Dr Anne McBride, If you can get in contact with her i'd have thought she'll recommend you someone in your area if she knows of someone. Good luck x

Re: rage syndrome?

Louise B — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 21:16:12 GMT

Hi Sarah,

I'd get a full veterinary examination ASAP (including blood profiling - expecially liver function) followed by veterinary referral to a veterinary behaviourist - not the the local dog trainer under any circumstances. Avoid anyone that talks about dominant dogs and uses dominance theory with you as you will probably get bitten if you follow their advice.

If he is insured check your insurance. It may cover you for referral. I don't know where in Yorkshire you are but the University of Lincoln (Daniel Mills and others at the centre) will see you under veterinary referral.

If you can get video footage than that may help.

In the meantime the most important thing you can do is keep yourself and others safe. Given the behaviour you describe if he was my dog he would be wearing a basket muzzle and on a leash when it a public place.

Goodluck.

Re: rage syndrome?

Tracey Morgan — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 21:08:48 GMT

Hi there

I really feel for you. I'm going through something similar with my collie cross who is 9 years now. I have had him for the last 6 years and although he has always been slightly unpredictable he unprovoked attacked me last sunday and hurt my arms quite bad. I got him into work to be checked over and he seems fine and has been ok since. Around six months ago he was showing signs of aggression and because he was insured I got a referral and he had an MRI scan etc to make sure there was no lesion on his brain and he was clear, would this be an option for you?

I am now in a situation with my dog where last week may have been a one off or I have a much bigger problem on my hands. I really hope a behaviourist can help you and it's definately worth getting hime medically checked over, if nothing works I think you need to have a long hard talk with your family and as long as you've done everything you can whatever your decision will be the right one.

Sending you lots of love xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Re: rage syndrome?

Gillian Mostyn — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 21:06:30 GMT

Consider muzzling the dog when you take him out.

Re: rage syndrome?

Doolally — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 20:43:14 GMT

Take him to the vet to get him checked over and get a referal to a behaviourist - most vets will have one that they recommend.

IF you are to keep him, then you will need the whole family on board and will all have to follow the behaviourist's advice to the letter. I think it will be extremely hard work, as for whatever reason he feels he needs to get to this level of aggression he's gone way above the tolerance level most dogs are at. His behaviour is extreme so please get professional help asap.

The trouble with a rescue is you don't know what's happened before to make him escalate to this level, to him there's probably a perfectly reasonable explanation. Labelling it as rage syndrome won't help the diagnosis or treatment IMO. You can either manage him with help, or not.

Whatever behaviourist you chose, please don't go to one who recommends rank reduction programmes and talks about alpha this or that, go down that route and you're asking for trouble.

Best of luck

Re: rage syndrome?

dinkyd — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 20:20:40 GMT

Ooo just had a thought,where did you adopt your boy from?Would they have behaviorists to offer assistance/support?

Re: rage syndrome?

dinkyd — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 20:15:16 GMT

Have you had him checked over by you vet to rule out any medical reason?

If looking for behaviourist I would advise a APBC qualified behaviourist - they have a website where you can find one closest to you.

With regards to injections for reducing aggression - this will not remove the reason why he is displaying this behaviour.

Poor boy hope you get to the bottom of his issues.

Re: rage syndrome?

Steph Worsley — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 19:47:50 GMT

hi to get to a decent behaviourist you need to be referred through your vet, speak to them and see who they normally use (I personally would suggest Sarah Heath, though not sure if she covers into Yorkshire, I know she does stuff in lancs though)

get him seen, if possible film these episodes so they can see them cos he prob wont show it when they see him. try and keep a diary to see if anything seems to trigger them off.

Re: rage syndrome?

Sal the 1st — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 19:38:09 GMT

Supralorin?

But I think more than anything else you need some really good advice from a good behaviourist - and to help them advise you the best they can as much information about this dog as you can, so yes I would contact whoever you rescued it from for more history to see if this is a longer standing problem

Re: rage syndrome?

Nicola Russell — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 19:24:23 GMT

tbh I don't know, I read it Textbook of Veterinary Internal Medicine, which is a US textbook, so may not be available over here. Looking it up again, I found the dose rate is 11mg/kg given IM or SQ every 4 months

Re: rage syndrome?

Fleabee99 — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 19:15:21 GMT

[quote user="Nicola Russell"]

I have read that depo-provera (the human contraceptive injection) is used to reduce aggression in animals

[/quote]

do vets offer that for aggressive dogs?

Re: rage syndrome?

Nicola Russell — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 19:08:33 GMT

I have read that depo-provera (the human contraceptive injection) is used to reduce aggression in animals

Re: rage syndrome?

Fleabee99 — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 19:07:21 GMT

also, random question, my partner keeps suggesting an injection that can be administered to dogs to reduce aggression, is this true? as i have never heard of this

anyone?

Re: rage syndrome?

Celine — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 19:00:53 GMT

OOps only just saw your profile and location - maybe contact Mugford and ask for a personal recommendation for someone up your way? x

Re: rage syndrome?

Celine — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 18:59:07 GMT

In my (quite amateur) opinion, a dog that was "simply" abused would be exhibiting signs of fearfulness, etc etc, fairly consistently (unless there is a trigger here that you haven't picked up on but doesn't sound it). So what he is doing is exhibiting unexplained, seemingly very random aggression which escalates quickly and sounds quite fixated...

I would find the very best behaviourist you can to help you - where in the country are you?

Roger Mugford has an excellent reputation

http://www.companyofanimals.co.uk/

Obviously you or I would always recommend to a client that the dog should have a full check-up, potentially including bloodwork, before going to a behaviourist, so take your own advice! But get onto this problem quickly - this sort of behaviour can only escalate over time.

Good luck

Re: rage syndrome?

Fleabee99 — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 18:44:03 GMT

where would i find a qualified dog behaviouist? when i look on the net i only get "experienced" dog trainer, obviously i need a proper opinion on what his options are

Re: rage syndrome?

Kim Buckley — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 18:36:56 GMT

I would def get a decent behaviourists advice. You can't have a dog that you are scared of. It's not fair on you.

A receptionist I used to work with had a JRT who had suspected rage syndrome and he put her in hospital a number of times before she decided to put him to sleep.

Re: rage syndrome?

Gillian Mostyn — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 18:35:05 GMT

[quote user="Fleabee99"]i think that maybe the next step, as i said earlier we believed he may have been abused but by all means he could have been doing this to them and they had enough, we were only told that the couple were having a baby and wanted rid of him[/quote]

We hear this all the time and it is rarely true. Almost no one rehomes a well behaved healthy dog just because they are pregnant. But a badly behaved or ill one.....now that is 'disposed of' asap.

Re: rage syndrome?

Fleabee99 — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 18:29:57 GMT

my worry is that 99% of the time he is perfect and its that 1% suggests its a problem that is out of our control =(

Re: rage syndrome?

Fleabee99 — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 18:28:04 GMT

i think that maybe the next step, as i said earlier we believed he may have been abused but by all means he could have been doing this to them and they had enough, we were only told that the couple were having a baby and wanted rid of him, should i take him to the vets ? or to a behaviourist?

Re: rage syndrome?

Sal the 1st — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 18:18:11 GMT

is it worth gettig in touch with the rescue and asking if this was the reason his first owners passed him on?

ie is this something he has done before?

Re: rage syndrome?

loobylou — Sun, 12 Sep 2010 18:15:06 GMT

I would maybe speak to an experienced behaviourist and see what they suggest. Sounds very scary and potentially very dangerous and I dont think you are wrong to think of pts.