Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

Claire Cameron — Tue, 26 Jan 2010 19:50:53 GMT

[quote user="Sarah S"]I was born with a dislocated hip however the doctors didn't discover this until I was two. They thought the fact that I was dragging myself across the floor and not attempting to walk was because I was a 'slow learner'. Like I said little was known about my condition so I got loads of tests done before they diagnosed it.[/quote]

[quote user="Sarah S"]My joints are very flexible and I can bend my fingers back which freaks people out[/quote]

hehe, good party trick if nothing else

[quote user="Sarah S"]I'm getting quite stiff so will probably become arthritic in the future[/quote]

Same here and I'm 24

[quote user="Sarah S"]Hopefully one day I'll see an animal diagnosed with EDS as it would be interesting to see the similarities however I'm sure it would be quite sad as the same time as I'm sure the outcome would be quite bleak.[/quote]

I'd quite like to see another case with EDS, but I hope that I don't see one as bad as my kitten. As I was so emotionally involved I found it hard to understand entirely until after he'd gone. Himalyan cats are predisposed to this.

I've since spoke to several vets about the condition and very few (1 or 2) have actually heard of it, none of which have seen it before. It is also known as Feline Cutaneous Asthenia.

We have a lovely client at work who was a paediatric nurse and has seen it regularly in children when she was working and her husband was a neonatologist so I've had interesting chats with her about it.

I had a kitten with EDS, fascinating clinically but just wish he wasn't mine so I wasn't so attached, he had it really bad, started off not so bad but got progessively worse as he got older (Got him when he was 3 weeks old and PTS at 14weeks )

He was presented with a lesion on his ear, suspected to be caused by mother overgrooming, sutured and healed ok but then broke down at slightest touch, then he gained small wound by his other ear when he scratched that started off miniscule (2mm) then rapidly stretched with no intervention/trauma to over 5cm. Numerous other wounds and hyperelastic skin, when he ran around his skin wouldn't go back to normal so he had 'bat wings' in his armpits of 'saggy' skin. He wore a modified tubigrip around his body to protect himself and a buster collar, but one day he managed to contort himself and groomed his foot and the skin just disintegrated even the slightest touch would cause his skin to tear.

He was such a character and his illness never phased him at all. I think had he not had the condition so severely he may still be here today but I spoke to several experts who didn't have a clue what else to advise for him.

Looking back his eyes looked droopy, I guess due to EDS but at the time I was just worried about him. I did a lot of research after I lost him.

Here he is my little Geoffrey.

The following links are quite interesting re EDS in cats

http://bulletin.piwet.pulawy.pl/archive/50-4/37_Szczepanik.pdf

http://www.thelanaproject.com/adoptable-pets/adoptable-pet---emerson-siamese-cat-with-ehlers-danlos-syndrome.html

http://www.lumrix.net/health/Ehlers-Danlos_syndrome.html

http://dspace.library.cornell.edu:8080/bitstream/1813/2566/1/2003%20Cornelison.pdf

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

Sarah S — Tue, 26 Jan 2010 19:30:10 GMT

Hi Claire,

I'll check the website out.

.I was born with a dislocated hip however the doctors didn't discover this until I was two. They thought the fact that I was dragging myself across the floor and not attempting to walk was because I was a 'slow learner'. Like I said little was known about my condition so I got loads of tests done before they diagnosed it. My joints are very flexible and I can bend my fingers back which freaks people out. I was my mum's first child and she just thought that all babies were that bendy. The older I get my joints thankfully don't dislocate as often and I usually get a warning but I'm getting quite stiff so will probably become arthritic in the future.

Hopefully one day I'll see an animal diagnosed with EDS as it would be interesting to see the similarities however I'm sure it would be quite sad as the same time as I'm sure the outcome would be quite bleak.

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

Claire Cameron — Sat, 23 Jan 2010 16:23:09 GMT

[quote user="Sarah S"]Claire what class of EDS do you have? I've never met anyone with this condition as when I was diagnosed 25 years ago, the doctors didn't have much information on it.[/quote]

I've never had the class graded but currently having physio due to luxating patella due to EDS. I don't seem to have hyperelastic skin, infact I never really scar, the amount of bad scratches I've had over the years and they've always healed, then scar disappeared, I'm quite dark skinned (caucasian but slightly olive) so assume this is why and not due to EDS?

I got given an information sheet with this website included which is quite helpful

http://www.ehlers-danlos.org/

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

Sarah S — Sat, 23 Jan 2010 10:45:05 GMT

Hi,

Just reading this post and its intersting to hear that Ehlers Danlos is now being diagnosed in animals. I have EDS class 3 which means that all my joints dislocate and i have hyperelasticity of my skin. When I was younger, my skin would rip easily and bleed forever if I fell and would easily scar if I had to undergo surgical procedures. Whenever I've mentioned my condition to any of the vets that I've worked with no one has had a clue what i'm talking about. I've never seen an animal with this condition and would imagine that it would be difficult to control as you can't tell an animal to not scratch their skin or play with other animals carefully.

Claire what class of EDS do you have? I've never met anyone with this condition as when I was diagnosed 25 years ago, the doctors didn't have much information on it.

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

Vicky RVN — Sun, 17 Jan 2010 14:57:25 GMT

I'm glad she's doing ok at the moment, keeping my for her!

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

claire Speight — Sun, 17 Jan 2010 14:51:55 GMT

Hi Saskia,

The biopsy was inconclusive - she has now finish her baytril course and has gone back outside with the other 2 but even when she was inside further tears (albeit much smaller ones) have appeared, so the problem seems not to be related to the other rabbits or being outside in the cold.

With all that in mind I have now arranged a referral appointment for the 27th Jan so will see what that brings about. So sadly I'm not really much closer to any sort of diagnosis bt at least she hasn't had anymore of the really large tears and the ones from a couple of weeks ago have healed really well - so much so that I struggled to find the nylon sutures to remove last week from the biopsy!

I'll keep you posted and thank you for asking.

Claire

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

Saskia Quinn — Sun, 17 Jan 2010 11:01:17 GMT

Hi Claire,

any more word on your rabbit?

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

SmegSlayer — Thu, 07 Jan 2010 09:54:43 GMT

Try Mark Rowlands at Trinity vets in Ashford, Kent. Very friendly and knowledgable- no problem too small for him. You do have to be a bit patient as he has a bad stammer but he def knows his stuff!

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

claire Speight — Tue, 05 Jan 2010 12:27:30 GMT

[quote user="NickyVN"]

This sounds so much like my bunny. Her skin would just tear when trying to clip up etc. In the mean time while awaiting results look into some vitamin e for her - good for skin health and flexibility and won't cause any problems.

[/quote]

Have just PM'd you....

Claire

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

Nicola Smith — Tue, 05 Jan 2010 09:34:59 GMT

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

claire Speight — Mon, 04 Jan 2010 12:44:00 GMT

Thanks for all your replies and help.

Have taken a biopsy today but the skin was just splitting in the surrounding areas when we were clipping, even though we were being extra careful about it. It looks so sore and I am concerned that it will be something that isn't going to be treatable, but will see what the histo comes back with.

Claire

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

Claire Cameron — Mon, 04 Jan 2010 09:39:29 GMT

Hiya

I had a kitten with this condition and also have the mild form myself but only affects my joints (hyper-flexible)

If I can be of any help please feel free to PM me

Claire

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

Rachel Jayne — Sun, 03 Jan 2010 22:33:00 GMT

Sounds awful for bun, hope you get to the bottom of it soon! x

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

claire Speight — Sun, 03 Jan 2010 18:08:13 GMT

[quote user="NickyVN"]

Hi, my rescue dwarf lop has this!! She was diagnosed about 4 years sgo after keep getting wounds for no reason. Had her stitched up a few times the finally vet dealing with her realised something not right as tried to groom her and skin just came with the hair. I don't know if she was always like this as she was a rescue. I spoke to Francis Harcourt Brown who has diagnosed a few of these, mainly in lops. I did extensive tests including skin biopsies, bloods incl thyroid etc. She is much better than she was and skin not as fragile as before but stil has to have very careful management. She also hates to be touched - people with the condition describe even the lightest touch as being very painful. If you want any advice on management feel free to pm me, mine has been particularly hard work as is long haired. I can tell you the things that used to cause the tears etc. I got advice from the Bunny Camp in York as well as they had a bunny with the same there. Good luck. Hear from you soon.

[/quote]

If it does turn out to be EDS then I shall def be contacting you! Thanks for your help.

Claire

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

claire Speight — Sun, 03 Jan 2010 18:07:38 GMT

Thanks for your replies and - I've enailed a few vets that I know, including Sharon Redrobe and have had a few replies back with various suggestions, so I think I am going to go for skin scrapes and a biopsy tomorrow and see what that shows.

Claire

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

Robocop — Sun, 03 Jan 2010 16:44:38 GMT

Have you tried speaking to these guys, they may be able to help you....

http://www.langfordvets.co.uk/rabbit_disease.htm

Hope she gets better soon.

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

Nicola Smith — Sun, 03 Jan 2010 15:55:50 GMT

Re: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome in rabbits

Sandra Taylor RVN, MBVNA — Sun, 03 Jan 2010 15:29:43 GMT

I have only seen this syndrome in a cat, so sorry I am no help