Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Angiy Michael — Sat, 27 Aug 2011 01:13:50 GMT

Hi Phrin, I understand what you are saying ..and yes I do scruff but only when I absolutely have to ..I usually try to hold cats minimally and when not possible then I try to use finger and thumb to massage above the peri-orbital area when holding near the head to try to calm the cat, next level up would be using a towel or cat bag..although generally find a towel less distressing to get a cat wrapped in just due to the time a bag can take, and again massaging around head..and absolutely worst case scenario then I scruff. I understand what you are saying and it's a valid point..in which case this technique may be preferable to scruffing ..my concern is that too many people scruff from the outset and so may just use this as a replacement rather than a technique to be used when absolutely needed I would say that the majoirty of VN's in my ( large) practice scruff more than they don't ..and it's usually not needed

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Phrin Vernon RVN — Sat, 27 Aug 2011 00:38:38 GMT

[quote user="Angiy Michael"]

If Sarah Heath says it's unethical I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole..I use her as my behavioural litmus paper/guru..she's the lady in the know

[/quote]

Do you scruff? Not trying to be obtuse honest! Just interested as i have found cats respond much better to pinching or clipnosis rather than scruffing.

Of course I'd rather not use either approach, but we all get the ones with whom the gently gently approach doesn't work

ETA - I'm showing my ignorance here, but I have no idea what Sarah Heath recommends for the problem cats? Again just interested... :)

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Angiy Michael — Fri, 26 Aug 2011 23:05:06 GMT

If Sarah Heath says it's unethical I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole..I use her as my behavioural litmus paper/guru..she's the lady in the know

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

littleblue — Mon, 22 Aug 2011 08:32:51 GMT

Wow, I am going to try this on difficult to restrain kitties and see how it goes. I agree with being gentle as possible, though. But sometimes kitty just doesn't wanna stay still!

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Phrin Vernon RVN — Sat, 30 Jul 2011 19:02:58 GMT

[quote user="les punton"]

[quote user="Phrin Vernon RVN"]Less is deffo more with cats ;)[/quote]

I def agree with this though, I never scruff unless absolutely nec

[/quote]

Me neither. Drives me nuts when I see people scruffing and /or pinning cats before giving the gently gently approach a try!

One VN I know always goes in heavy handed - she gets bitten regularly..... I always go for less is more, and have never been bitten - nuff said!

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Phrin Vernon RVN — Sat, 30 Jul 2011 18:58:59 GMT

[quote user="aimee pryme"]

I tried the 'pinchong' the scruff today......... so i pinched her scruff and it worked really well!!...........

will definatly use it again

[/quote]

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

les punton — Sat, 30 Jul 2011 18:43:58 GMT

[quote user="Phrin Vernon RVN"]Less is deffo more with cats ;)[/quote]

I def agree with this though, I never scruff unless absolutely nec

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Aimee Barber — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 12:54:02 GMT

Hey,

I tried the 'pinchong' the scruff today. Had a siamese (if you please) for a heart scan today, she would not lie still, kept scrunching her neck etc... so i pinched her scruff and it worked really well!! almost thought i could have let go of her legs, but wasn't going to chance it

She seemed really calm and much less vocal/stressing. as soon as i let go she wanted fuss and love again so i dont think it fazed her just encouraged her to lie still

will definatly use it again

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Phrin Vernon RVN — Thu, 28 Jul 2011 22:18:00 GMT

When I have used it, one or two clothes pegs are placed on the scruff of the cat - most cats go a bit quieter, some go really flat and you are able to do almost anything, and some don't react at all. If they don't react then I put them back in the kennel, let them chill, get them out, do nothing but tlc, put them back, then get them out again and do the most minimal restraint possible - you almost have to make the cat think that it was their idea to sit still for a b/s, or endure sandbags for a rad! Often making tutututshhh type of noises helps, along with blowing gently on their nose, and sometimes getting eye contact and slooow blinking!

One vet taught me a good trick - that 'pinching' with thumb & forefinger, a cats scruff, rather than scruffing with your whole hand iyswim, has pretty much the same effect as 'clipnosis'

A bit scary as you have little control if they do freak out, but it has worked for me in the past, especially with cats that are just damn well fed up of being pinned to the table!

Less is deffo more with cats ;)

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

les punton — Thu, 28 Jul 2011 19:45:32 GMT

iv never used this technique before and would be willing to give it a go but would be worried that certain cats you try it on gets very annoyed and thenyou struggle to handle afterwards?

Although cons xrays seem like a good idea!

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

supamog — Thu, 28 Jul 2011 18:04:48 GMT

oooo just watched that vid on utube! That bulldog clip looked a bit harsh but to be fair cat didn't seem that bothered! I was thinking more plastic clothes pegs lol.

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

supamog — Thu, 28 Jul 2011 18:01:46 GMT

hi i took some pegs into work ages ago but haven't thought about using them yet as i am the "cat holder". Just out of interest where exactly are the pegs placed and how many?

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Aimee Barber — Fri, 15 Jul 2011 16:38:28 GMT

Hey,

I was curious about this aswell. personnaly I think it would be ok for short periods of time. I found this Video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDGHgrf2WZw

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Louise B — Thu, 10 Feb 2011 19:42:38 GMT

[quote user="Princess Ophelia Hermione MacBeth"]

Thanks for the replies so far guys. Much appreciated. Has anybody seen a case where clipnosis has had an adverse effect on the cat? What signs did you see that made you feel it was aversive? Behavioural? Physiological? Have you ever seen a case where the animal's health was compromised by clipnosis? e.g. dyspnoea worsened, etc

[/quote]

Bump!

Also,

Those of you who have used this technique....

1. How long on average does it last for (minutes)?

2. Do they become reactive again before the clips are removed OR do they reliably stay 'clipnosed' until the clips are removed?

Thanks for your replies so far - very much appreciated

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

staceyvn — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 18:21:40 GMT

im not too sure what clipnosis is,but iv used clothes pegs on cats that require restrant for a conscious radiogaph and it works well, u just loosely attach them to the scruff in a line ie cran-caudal, not dorso-vent, it can make them think uv still got hold of them then fire off ur xray, job done. i dont think its unethical id rather do that than risk knocking out a comprimised patient and killing it or something hideous.

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Shelly vn — Mon, 07 Feb 2011 18:38:10 GMT

We used to do it at my last practice, there was one vet in particular that was very keen on it, but i hated doing it. feel free to PM me if you have any questions

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Louise B — Sat, 05 Feb 2011 19:01:18 GMT

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Laura Ringsell — Sat, 05 Feb 2011 15:52:53 GMT

[quote user="Kim Blowing RVN"]Have used it before on a rta cat who we needed to x-ray but didn't want to sedate due to it's condition. Worked really well.

[/quote]

My experience is the same - a dyspnoeic cat that can not be sedated/anaesthtised but needs an xray will lie perfectly still with the use of pegs - being as this is not a behavioural modification option and only for a few minutes i am not sure if it is relavant - but it does work very well

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Sal the 1st — Sat, 05 Feb 2011 15:24:09 GMT

[quote user="FINNIGAN"]

cant really see any difference in this method than just scruffing, scruffing surely has the same effect!!

[/quote]

no scruffing does not have the same effect

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Kim Buckley — Sat, 05 Feb 2011 14:46:15 GMT

Have used it before on a rta cat who we needed to x-ray but didn't want to sedate due to it's condition. Worked really well.

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Emma Purnell — Sat, 05 Feb 2011 13:48:55 GMT

[quote user="FINNIGAN"]

cant really see any difference in this method than just scruffing, scruffing surely has the same effect!!

[/quote]

I haven't used clipnosis myself, but I have tried scruffing on an unhandlable cat which worked wonders. However after this I can tell you the main difference - intense cramp in your hand at the crucial moment doesn't help!!

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

FINNIGAN — Sat, 05 Feb 2011 13:33:36 GMT

cant really see any difference in this method than just scruffing, scruffing surely has the same effect!!

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Claire Cameron — Sat, 05 Feb 2011 10:49:39 GMT

PM sent x

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Louise B — Sat, 05 Feb 2011 10:40:13 GMT

PM sent. Thanks Maisy.

If anyone else has used this please PM me or leave a message here and I'll get in contact.

Re: Clipnosis / pegs on cats - any one using this?

Maisy — Sat, 05 Feb 2011 10:26:36 GMT

Have used it with a few cats if that's any help? PM me if you need to.